So we should all convert to Judaism, then? :sarcastic


Thanks, correction made.

It's time for enforcing some tough love in this country. Sometimes we have to do what is best for our own future. Stop with the pondering, dilly-dallying and deceitful cries of "Unfair, unfair! You want to send them back to their country 'cause you don't like them" - Please STOP 'cause that's not the case. Many Bahamians have Haitian backgrounds, but not everyone from Haiti can expect to come here looking for a new life. It's time for action in THEIR country and OURS! :sailing:


I see that this issue for you is kind of personal so I will not run on about it, but what I will say here is that we have been doing what you said for pass decades and yet we still identify it as a big problem. What I suggest here is only one of dozens of ideas that we can implement as add-ons to the program that is already in progress, (there are a whole lot more ideas suggested by individuals I know).

I do not disagree that we should not export foreigners that do not align with the ideas of the Bahamian people, but exporting the Haitians alone does not work, otherwise we would not have this problem because we have been shipping them out and continue to ship them out. The over all economical situations in Haiti must improve and if we ought to solve the problem here, then we ought to help out along the way, we must participate directly in the affairs of the Haitian people in their country our fair share along with other countries and organization. Yet we can never dismiss fairness if we want the law to be enforced and to be effective, then all foreigners are included regardless. And, to those who will eventually come here and remain must have some background knowledge of what we are about and their responsibility to this nation and it citizens.

..exporting the Haitians alone does not work, otherwise we would not have this problem because we have been shipping them out and continue to ship them out.

It ain't personal dread. Like I said before, this is business, not personal. When things gets personal that's when people lose focus.

When I say to send them back, I mean EVERY one who is here illegally. It didn't work over the past decades because of the "lackadaisical" attitude taken towards the entire immigration process. If foreigners know that they are breaking Bahamian laws and are treated as such, they will get the message.

You mean to tell me that you propose just throwing our arms up in the air in terms of deportation and saying, "Oh well, they'll keep coming anyway"? That is so typical of Bahamians - we need to stop procrastinating when dealing with things that affect Bahamian culture. We like to let things keep on getting worse until it gets to the point where we are forced to deal with the situation. Let me tell you something: A mass deportation would get so much publicity that it probably would be the perfect deterrent. Believe that.

Well Written YORICK, and Very Sobering. I Still Believe, Mass Deportation,of All Illegals.is Very Necessary.we Simply Cannot,absorb Anymore Illegal Immigrants.

It ain't personal dread. Like I said before, this is business, not personal. When things gets personal that's when people lose focus.

If you think you can put a suggestion forward and not have it put under a torch then it is best that you don't suggest, it will be scrutinized and I have not even began to do that and it seems to be getting more personal.

Everyone so far who have respond to your commentary is saying well said, I have said the same thing to you myself, but I am the only one that is asking the questions here.
If we are going to be effective we can not have one man making the decisions. In this country we need committees (something we do not have in this country) who are willing to question things to debate the matters, individuals like myself who are not afraid to do so. What can we lose but to strengthen the matters at question before it goes ahead to regret or to make matters worst?
Why it is that no one here in Bahamas Issues wants to be challenged? I have agreed with you in many of your posting here in Bahamas Issues, I am not disagreeing with you here, you are making that up yourself, what I am doing now is challenging you, nothing more.

Let’s stay focus.

My point remains the same:

1. How? You say send them back, I say send them back.
2. Why is that not working? You said no one is sending them back, I don’t think so.
3. We have been sending them back all along and at our expense at no expense of the Haitian people.
4. We still have the same problem!
5. What do we do? Continue sending them back? Yes, yes, yes.
6. That’s not working.
7. What do we do?
8. How do we do it and how do we make it work?


If we think that we can put a suggestion forward without having it put under a torch then it is better not to mention it at all.

I Digress, Iupdate. I Was Suppose To Comment On That Previous Thread,from U Do Make A Lot Of Sense,butthe Fact Still Remains We Have Not Assiduously, Dealt With The Way That We Repatriate.my Suggestion Is To Give Citizenship To Those Who Were Born Here.give Them Status.but Our Laws Need To Be Changed,if You Were ,born Here ,of Illegal Haitain Parentage U Should Assume The Citizen Ship Of Your Mother. Without Being Able To Attain Citizen Ship After Eighteen
There Is No Amount Of Negation,that Can Nullify The Fact That Haitians Have There Place In Bahamain Society,but,we Still Have To Be Stewards Of This Bahamaland .while We Are Not Indigenous People,we Still Have To Preserve And Protect For Future Bahamians.we Need To Assimilate Those Who Have Been Here For The Long Haul.but At The Sane Time We Need Control And We Need It Now.

I Digress, Iupdate. I Was Suppose To Comment On That Previous Thread,from U Do Make A Lot Of Sense,butthe Fact Still Remains We Have Not Assiduously, Dealt With The Way That We Repatriate.my Suggestion Is To Give Citizenship To Those Who Were Born Here.give Them Status.but Our Laws Need To Be Changed,if You Were ,born Here ,of Illegal Haitain Parentage U Should Assume The Citizen Ship Of Your Mother. Without Being Able To Attain Citizen Ship After Eighteen
There Is No Amount Of Negation,that Can Nullify The Fact That Haitians Have There Place In Bahamain Society,but,we Still Have To Be Stewards Of This Bahamaland .while We Are Not Indigenous People,we Still Have To Preserve And Protect For Future Bahamians.we Need To Assimilate Those Who Have Been Here For The Long Haul.but At The Sane Time We Need Control And We Need It Now.


(I hope you don't actually press shift to capitalize the first letter of each word you type)

Myself as well as Rizzo, I beleive, suggested that we send all illegals back, and we also suggested that the government allow illegals to work on a farm doing agriculture work for legitimate salary on a big island like Andros. And take a small tax from their salaries to aid in deporting costs of those that refuse to work on the farms.

I am not suggesting that farming be the only career option, just that the government provide some means for those here to earn an honest living with an honest salary.

1. We need to deport the illegals.
2. If we can't deport them, we should at least chemically castrate them - i.e. prevent them from reproducing - not prevent them from having intercourse just reproduction.
3. Crack down on the business owners that are hiring illegal immigrants and also those paying unfair salaries.
4. Provide a way for the illegals to become citizens and perhaps charge them a fee that would go towards re-patriation of the illegals.
5. Tax the legal haitians a small fee to help with repatriation.

One thing is certain, we don't seem to have the resources to repatriate or prevent them from coming here. Once here they have tons of children and take over our land and public facilities - free of charge.

Personally I feel that the problem will never be solved and we will soon legally become a Bahamian-Haitian nation. Many of them are having children with Bahamian citizens and that will cause an uproar should they start deporting.

1. We need to deport the illegals.
Yes we do.

2. If we can't deport them, we should at least chemically castrate them - i.e. prevent them from reproducing - not prevent them from having intercourse just reproduction.
My word! I can see that going down well with human rights groups - not!!! :what: :what:

3. Crack down on the business owners that are hiring illegal immigrants and also those paying unfair salaries.
True

4. Provide a way for the illegals to become citizens and perhaps charge them a fee that would go towards re-patriation of the illegals.
First part yes, second part no. If that were the case, all Bahamians should be charged as well. Which, in a way, we are already!

5. Tax the legal haitians a small fee to help with repatriation.

Good idea. Hard to implement.

1. We need to deport the illegals.
2. If we can't deport them, we should at least chemically castrate them - i.e. prevent them from reproducing - not prevent them from having intercourse just reproduction.
3. Crack down on the business owners that are hiring illegal immigrants and also those paying unfair salaries.
4. Provide a way for the illegals to become citizens and perhaps charge them a fee that would go towards re-patriation of the illegals.
5. Tax the legal haitians a small fee to help with repatriation.

One thing is certain, we don't seem to have the resources to repatriate or prevent them from coming here. Once here they have tons of children and take over our land and public facilities - free of charge.


Ronnie, bsmbahamas & CG this is exactly what I am saying. I appreciate discussions that say what we need to do and how to do it. I appreciate the feed back that suggest the possible outcome even though what we do here is unofficial and is only in theory.

Often enough we say what it is that we want but not often enough how to make it possible. What is wrong with doing that here? We expect that our officials have all the answers. Often they don’t! Even though our officials pay high consultancy fees to foreigners, many of those advise often do not workout, when at first it makes sense for officials to first consent the Bahamian people. We may not respect each other as Bahamian advisers but regardless there are some good suggestions posted here and we can not be discouraged when or if our comments are placed before a “firing squad.” We do have very good advisers here in this country and also here in Bahamas issues (even though we may attack each other in disgust, yet that is the way the world functions and we move on), but we must somehow be willing to expose it regardless to whether it is our business or not.

I do not at all disagree that we should ship the foreigners back, send them back but why should we Bahamian raised tax payers alone be responsible each time to foot the bill each time we send them out of here without any cost to the Haitian government or the traffickers or people who are responsible for returning them here within weeks?
And, if we are going to have Bahamian born Haitians up for citizenship (even if only some of them) take why should we not be responsible for their education and culture while they are still in Haiti?

The problem is bigger than we think, and as much as we exposed this point is we need other ways of bringing this problem to some intended result.

I know myself of several Haitian born individuals who were returned to Haiti as many as three times a peace and is still here today.

I know of several Bahamian born Haitians that were refused passports but obtained their passports through other channels and then speak out in rebellion against the Bahamas and against Bahamian raised brothers.

I know of several foreigners who married to obtain spouse permits and dump their Bahamian spouses and remain here functioning in this country as ordinary residents and citizens and some who have even been given permits to remain here many protected by our government mostly in the Ministry of Health and the Ministry of Education, by ministry officials and big business owners. Even though this makes them legal I view this as circumventing the law a good loop hold to fulfill their personal interest legal with very little or no benefit to the Bahamian people. Nevertheless, these people are here legally and I do not think that most suggestions are dealing with this kind of issues or similar issues across the board only the Haitians they are our only problem, right, its not important to be fair? Then how do we get ahead? What do you say about this Yorickbrown? I can go on and on but I will stop here.

I'll reiterate my previous comments.

Let me be very specific on this, I'll try to simply the entire scenario: As I said before, when I speak of deportation I speak of doing it on a mass scale, not "piece by piece" as it has been done in the past. I'm talking about thousands at a time. If you do not have your legal papers, you WILL be deported, along with any and ALL of your children who were born here (they can claim citizenship when they are 18 through the Bahamas embassy in Haiti). The idea of a southern island to be used as a processing center is a good one - this way they can work to pay off the costs it takes to send them back.

During the time that deportations would occur, the RBDF would have to purchase several sea planes, (equipped with long range radar) to aid in patrolling our Southernmost border. They only need to patrol the area that starts from Cuba's border heading straight east on the borderline between The Bahamas and Haiti/Dominican Republic, on a 24-hour continuous basis, no less.

There is another benefit to patrolling the south as well - We've locked up most of our Bahamian drug lords, making room for the Haitian ones to take over our territory. The concept of bringing in illegal drugs right now is extremely simple - just bring them in on the Haitian boats. Most of them get into our borders unchecked. Millions of dollars of cocaine pass into this country and since few Bahamian authorities go into the Haitian villages, these drugs probably won't ever get detected. They can pass from island to island, hidden by this underground network of illegal immigrants. Although we all know that this country was founded upon illegal concepts (from piracy, rum-running, drug-running, to illegal immigrant smuggling), we can't lock up all our drug boys only to let some illegal immigrant take over and do the same thing! From a criminal standpoint (not that I would know) that's just pitiful. :cool:

The innocent may suffer for the guilty in this case, but the influx of illegal immigrants is at a ridiculous level at this point. The idea is to get them out and then put measures in place to keep them out. They can then pursue living in The Bahamas on LEGAL terms from Haiti. The basic message is that our system of government will NOT tolerate this illegal behavior anymore. Otherwise, the government of the Bahamas can be viewed as incompetent officials who cannot even protect the rights of their own people or even stop others from abusing our country for their own purposes.

If their illegal behavior is allowed to continue, I propose that we give all citizens of The Bahamas one instance of illegal behavior that can be ignored, to make things fair and equal. The government of Bahamas cannot tell its citizens to abide by the law, when they allow foreigners to get away with breaking it so easily. :hammer:

I'll reiterate my previous comments.

Let me be very specific on this, I'll try to simply the entire scenario: As I said before, when I speak of deportation I speak of doing it on a mass scale, not "piece by piece" as it has been done in the past. I'm talking about thousands at a time. If you do not have your legal papers, you WILL be deported, along with any and ALL of your children who were born here (they can claim citizenship when they are 18 through the Bahamas embassy in Haiti). The idea of a southern island to be used as a processing center is a good one - this way they can work to pay off the costs it takes to send them back.

During the time that deportations would occur, the RBDF would have to purchase several sea planes, (equipped with long range radar) to aid in patrolling our Southernmost border. They only need to patrol the area that starts from Cuba's border heading straight east on the borderline between The Bahamas and Haiti/Dominican Republic, on a 24-hour continuous basis, no less.

There is another benefit to patrolling the south as well - We've locked up most of our Bahamian drug lords, making room for the Haitian ones to take over our territory. The concept of bringing in illegal drugs now is extremely simple - just bring them in on the Haitian boats. Most of them get into our borders unchecked. Millions of dollars of cocaine pass into this country and since few Bahamian authorities go into the Haitian villages, these drugs probably won't ever get detected. They can pass from island to island, hidden by this underground network of immigrants. While we all know that this country was founded upon illegal concepts (from piracy, rum-running, drug-running, to illegal immigrant smuggling), we can't lock up all our boys to let some illegal immigrant take over and do the same thing! From a criminal standpoint (not that I would know) that's just pitiful. :cool:

The innocent may suffer for the guilty in this case, but the influx of illegal immigrants is ridiculous at this point. The idea is to get them out and then put measures in place to keep them out. They can then pursue living in The Bahamas on LEGAL terms from Haiti. The basic message is that our system of government will not tolerate this illegal behavior anymore. Otherwise, the government of the Bahamas can be viewed as incompetent officials who cannot even protect the rights of their own people or even stop others from abusing our country for their own purposes.

If their illegal behavior is allowed to continue, I propose that we give all citizens of The Bahamas one instance of illegal behavior that can be ignored, to make things fair and equal. The government of Bahamas cannot tell its citizens to abide by the law, when they allow foreigners to get away with breaking it so easily. :hammer:


Excellently, put. Don't we have about $26,000,000 of high speed interceptor ships currently docked at Prince George Wharf? When was the last time they did a patrol?

I am afraid that this is a problem we are going to have to live with. It is a sad fact that this has gone on for years, and years, and years, and years - Bahamian Governments simply cannot handle this situation. Minister Roker, I think it was, came close but no one else has been able to come to grips with it.

It is not that difficult a job. It requires a bit of brain power and a lot of man power, but it can be done. However, I can see no one on the horizon who is equal to the task. The flood-gates of illegal immigration will remain open until someone is found who can shut them, fairly and with some compassion. In the mean time, learn Creole. It will soon be our second language.

Then The Bahamas should prepare for the same level of instability that is currently in Haiti. It may not happen now, it may not happen in the next 10 years, but it will happen when the little Haitian kids that we now see going to school grow up and demand that the doors are opened wider for their people - This country will be split in half. With the resentment that has already reared its head against the citizens of The Bahamas, I suspect that these Haitians descendants will remain loyal to Haiti. With each year that passes, it will become more difficult to not "step on anyone's toes" by deporting illegals. This process needs to be done now.

If the government and the people of this nation are ready to give away our country so easily, then we do not deserve it and it should be taken from us. A boat ride escaping a hard life does not change a person's mentality nor does it educate them or make them loyal to our flag. :bahamas:

MY vote next election will be for the party that is patriotic enough to do something about this situation. 'Nuff said.

Then The Bahamas should prepare for the same level of instability that is currently in Haiti. It may not happen now, it may not happen in the next 10 years, but it will happen when the little Haitian kids that we now see going to school grow up and demand that the doors are opened wider for their people - This country will be split in half. With the resentment that has already reared its head against the citizens of The Bahamas, I suspect that these Haitians descendants will remain loyal to Haiti. With each year that passes, it will become more difficult to not "step on anyone's toes" by deporting illegals. This process needs to be done now.

If the government and the people of this nation are ready to give away our country so easily, then we do not deserve it and it should be taken from us. A boat ride escaping a hard life does not change a person's mentality nor does it educate them or make them loyal to our flag.
You are right, we should prepare for instability. But we will not, any more that we are prepared to do anything about immigration - on the scale needed. It will soon be to late to reverse the situation.

MY vote next election will be for the party that is patriotic enough to do something about this situation. 'Nuff said.
There is no such party!

There is no such party!


Oh yeah, I forgot about that! :p