Wow!!Finally some stimulating arguments by Bahamians on the web!!!Joe Baboon and Truthseeker you have some very valid and interesting points.So to Delroy and dacy2003.I was brought up as Christian and I accepted the bible as God word.

But when reached adulthood,I began to question my faith.And I found it with many inconsistencies and conflicts.I began to study many religions and science to try and make sense of my existance.I ask questions to myself like:-

1.Why is it that every culture have a deity(ies) to worship?
2.Is God real?
3.Where did we come from?
4.Is Christianity the only true religion?
5.Did we evole from from from primates.

Ofcourse living in a "Christian nation" the only answer you will get is the answer you will get is even more confusion.I found that the only belief system that seems to come close to my spiritual quest is Buddhism.I use the phrase "belief system" so as not confuse it with some guy up in heaven who judges us every minute.Buddhist don,t believe (contrary to popular belief) in a God!We believe in universal law.There is no conflict between science and religion.

Most religion is just a part of universal law.Buddhism is not a dressed up version of athiesm nor is it thiesm.Universal law is all pervading just as laws the of physic.Do good to others and good will follow you.Do evil and evil will follow.There is no "chosen people or race" no sinners, no infidel,no caste.You are are your own savior or devil.No man on a cross or man/woman in heaven will save you.If this was the case,then no one could ever backslide from their religion!
I know this conflicts with Christianity but that it.
Our urge to worship is our urge to be one with the universe.This is the reason why man has created so many gods since we begin to walk upright.Good and evil is what we as humans create.I believe in evolution--the proof in undeniable.

If I have anyone confuse please post and I will try to clarify.I am not highly educated like some of you here (never been to college) but I read alot I try to suck up as much knowledge as possible.

It is a pleasure to have you with us. :D

First of all; I've never been to college also but I believe that when it comes to God, education doesn't matter because He gives true wisdom to the simple.

You said that when reached adulthood you began to question your faith. What caused this? Did someone present a question before you about Christianity that you were unable to answer? Or did something happen in your life that made you ask the question “Is God real?” I am just curious because it is not common for a Bahamian (not just a Christian) to turn to a religion from the far east, especially Buddhism.

You have the right to believe in whatever you desire but ask yourself: Doesn't this belief sound a little too free and easy?
I mean.... No sinners, no judges, you are are your own savior and devil?

Are there any form of authority in Buddhism besides oneself?

WOW
This is refreshing, atleast you're not trying to make we who chose to believe the Bible sound like we are enemy to the whole world.

Your belief is very confusing to me...but if it works for you than...I wish you had given Jesus another chance and this time get to know Him for yourself. I rebelled against the traditional ways of christian in the Bahamas.

I search for truth by reading up on other religions and study for one year with one, I never stop believing in Jesus and the teaching in the Bible, but I did this to form my own opinion on these most popular religion in the Bahamas. But most of them spend so much effort in trying to prove the Bible wrong.

I have learn that I need to have a personal relationship with MY God and not a religious experience. So I search the scriptures and found out that God is a God of principles. He does not comprise for anyone...He loves His creations, and does not want any of us to perish. But because of His principle and His Word is the Law that governor Him, He can not take sin. God has put everything in place that we live full, happy lives...

So I all I have to do is following the principles and guidelines in the Bible, talk to Him about those I struggle with, repent when I chose take shortcuts or rebell for whatever reason. Than there is the Holy Spirit, who is like a spiritual guide in my life who reminds me of the right ways, of the Father's love...

I Love MY God and I accept everything about HIM...because He has proven to be faithful and I never feel unloved by HIM:D :D

I see what you mean Proud Open Mind. Delroy is not only convinced of his belief he is fanatical about them. In the real world where most people reside we look for extraordinary evidence before we accept extrodinary claims. Delroy the answers to the first two question are as follows:

1) The original manuscripts are lost to us and what we read today in the various bibles were taken from copies. Biblical scribes did not have copying machines back then so it was handwritten, so you can imagine the mistakes made in the translation and the copying.

2) There can be no degree of certainty that the persons named as the authors are in fact those persons. Biblical scholars have agreed somewhat that only but a handful of the person named as bible authors are in fact that person. Just for your info. The gospel writers named are not the original writers. Their names were used to lend credit to those fantastic stories so that the people could be more convinced.

I will answer the next two questions later.

WOW

Your knowledge is overwhelming:D

Continue to seek....:cool:

Originally posted by Delroy
You said that when reached adulthood you began to question your faith. What caused this? Did someone present a question before you about Christianity that you were unable to answer? Or did something happen in your life that made you ask the question “Is God real?” I am just curious because it is not common for a Bahamian (not just a Christian) to turn to a religion from the far east, especially Buddhism.

You have the right to believe in whatever you desire but ask yourself: Doesn't this belief sound a little too free and easy?
I mean.... No sinners, no judges, you are are your own savior and devil?
__________________________________________________
On the contrary!!!There is nothing remotely easy about conquering the self.Buddhism is not a religion for people who want to do whatever they want and justify it as right,It don't work like that.These are attachment(suffering).Buddhism is about freeing one from one's attachments.Like I said ealier you will reap what ever you sow (Karma)
Christianity is easy.You do what you like then ask for forgiveness.
:D :D

_--_------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by dacy2003
Your belief is very confusing to me...but if it works for you than...I wish you had given Jesus another chance and this time get to know Him for yourself. I rebelled against the traditional ways of christian in the Bahamas.

I search for truth by reading up on other religions and study for one year with one, I never stop believing in Jesus and the teaching in the Bible, but I did this to form my own opinion on these most popular religion in the Bahamas. But most of them spend so much effort in trying to prove the Bible wrong.

I have learn that I need to have a personal relationship with MY God and not a religious experience. So I search the scriptures and found out that God is a God of principles. He does not comprise for anyone...He loves His creations, and does not want any of us to perish. But because of His principle and His Word is the Law that governor Him, He can not take sin. God has put everything in place that we live full, happy lives...

So I all I have to do is following the principles and guidelines in the Bible, talk to Him about those I struggle with, repent when I chose take shortcuts or rebell for whatever reason. Than there is the Holy Spirit, who is like a spiritual guide in my life who reminds me of the right ways, of the Father's love...

I Love MY God and


Are there any form of authority in Buddhism besides oneself?
____________________________________________
Jesus was a enlighten one-like the Buddha,Krisna,and Mohammad.To prove that Christ is God using scriptures is like a Muslim using the koran to prove that Allah is God.The bias is even more confusing.This technique can only work with a person who is already a subscriber of that religion. :D :D

originally posted by bigyouth
Christianity is easy. You do what you like then ask for forgiveness.

God can't be fooled and forgiveness will never be given to an insincere person.
If that was the case then what is the reason for Hell? Or is there no Hell in Buddha also?

Big Youth, Your statement is so valid:

"To prove that Christ is God using scriptures is like a Muslim using the koran to prove that Allah is God.The bias is even more confusing.This technique can only work with a person who is already a subscriber of that religion."

That is what I mean by circular reasoning. A Christian cannot use the Bible to prove God. Nor, as you say, can a Muslim use the Koran to prove Allah.

And it is interesting to see how Delroy et al. cannot see outside of their religion. They try to filter everything through the eyes of Christianity. Just for their information:

1) The Hell that you are referring to is a relatively modern concept in the Judeo-Christian faith. In ancient Isreal, there was no such thing as "hell". This concept of a place where you burn forever (such a loving god to do this to his children...) did not come till much later.

2) And on hell, why would I be scared to "burn" forever when I'm already dead. Let me see: The pain from fire comes due to a chemical reaction in my brain triggered by nerve endings in the affected part. To my knowledge, I have to be alive for this process to work. In other words: Dead people don't feel pain, because the nerve-ending to spinal cord-to brain thingy ceases upon death. With no nerve-endings (or body for that matter), why would I be concerned about this fire.

Said another way: The body is the source of physical pain. Once the body (or particular part of it) is finished, then so is the pain. I'm sure you've heard at funerals: "He/she is no longer in pain."

My point is that even if there was a hell, there is nothing to worry about.

3) About Buddism as an easy belief system: Even if it is easy - which it is not - why do you feel, Delroy, that a belief system must be hard? Why couldn't it be easy? Just because your own is "hard"? C'mon now, try not to filter everything through your own lenses.

The reality is that religion and spirituality is a cultural phenominum. Different cultures at different times defined and redefined their gods.

Even the practice of Christianity today in the Bahamas is markedly different from what it was 50 years ago and will be different 50 years from now. For instance, the idea of a woman walking into a church without a hat would have been grounds for stoning - or for a man to come to church in casual attire.

Indeed, my prediction is that consistent with other progressive nations, religion will continue to lose its influence in people's day to day lives. Indeed, everywhere where this has happened as a natural progression of society, the communities and countries have benefitted substantially.

WOW

proudopenmind, you use so many words to say soooo little:rolleyes:

Your prediction of the decline in the Bible influence on individual lives may will come true because the declares that men will have itching ears, and will seek after a faith that caters to their lust, so this was established long before you, so step back please:p

So even though humanity will chose other gods, (this is not new to GOD) HIS word will not change, HE will not change.

dacy2003 you seem very uncomfortable with knowledge. Don't let us intimidate you with information. If you need to find resource material you can visit the Secular Web also.

People have been skeptical about the stories in the bible from the day they were spoken in the oral tradition of that time. Not everyone was convinced, mostly the illiterate and lower class of society were. This was in order to keep them subjugated to the religious/political establishment. Even today we see this event occuring especially in the Bahamas where politicians and religious persons conspire together to influence society to their benefit with the expectation of retaining power over the masses. Perry Christie/Neil Ellis/Christian Council. Why does the government have to consult the churches everytime they are considering passing some controversial piece of legislation?

The religious political establishment know that their are many people like you dacy2003 who just not interested in seeking the truth so they pander to your so called spiritual desires. You need to wake up you and Delroy and smell the coffee

Originally posted by Truthseeker
dacy2003 you seem very uncomfortable with knowledge. Don't let us intimidate you with information. If you need to find resource material you can visit the Secular Web also.

People have been skeptical about the stories in the bible from the day they were spoken in the oral tradition of that time. Not everyone was convinced, mostly the illiterate and lower class of society were. This was in order to keep them subjugated to the religious/political establishment. Even today we see this event occuring especially in the Bahamas where politicians and religious persons conspire together to influence society to their benefit with the expectation of retaining power over the masses. Perry Christie/Neil Ellis/Christian Council. Why does the government have to consult the churches everytime they are considering passing some controversial piece of legislation?

The religious political establishment know that their are many people like you dacy2003 who just not interested in seeking the truth so they pander to your so called spiritual desires. You need to wake up you and Delroy and smell the coffee

Sorry Truthseeker but I don't drink coffee anymore. True wisdom comes from God; so whatever earthly knowledge you have can never intimidate a child of the Most High.

Your statement about illiterate people choosing to believe in God confirms that you lack the ability to speak with clear understanding of what you are saying. Jesus said in Matthew 15:11 that "Not what goes into the mouth defiles a man; but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man."

With all the knowledge you have; you still don't really know anything. Some of the most intelligent people in the world (who are mostly Jews) believe in God. Martin Luter King believed in God. Was He illiterate? There are millions of doctors and lawyer all over the world who believe in the name of Jesus Christ and if they are the lower class of society I don't wish to see the poor.

You need to wake up and see the light.

My dear Mr. truthseeker,

I try and be as gentle as possible.......

You are lost my brother, you are empty!

Knowlegde or information does not intimidate we...but...well informed intellects, like yourself, who are happy playing the fool really sets me off. It is difficult to see someone so inform be satisfy with running on with stupiness.


I can rightfully call you a fool, for the Bible declares that a fool says in his heart there is no GOD. The Bible also says that the fear of GOD is the beginning of wisdom. It is like GOD was describe some of you guys to the letter.

So dont you ever believe that you are arrive, because once you have arrive you are no good to anyone, and everything that is useless should be either recycled or disposed of.


So if believe in GOD makes me illiterate, than I'm your poster-girl!

:D :D :D

Delroy and dacy2003 I do not consider you illiterate or foolish for your beliefs. Had my statement been read carefully you would have realized that I meant the people of biblical times were illiterate. The poor working class in the society at that time did not have access to educatuion like we enjoy today. They could neither read nor write which was why most of the information was transmitted orally. Only those persons who had wealth and influence were able to become educated. Most poor persons at that time involve themselves in small scale subsistance farming and did not believe to much in education. This is one of the reasons why you find throughout the bible so many families with large number of persons.

Martin Luther King was an educated man who lived at a time when education was available to all, rich and poor, so of course he was not illerate. I don't believe Jews are the most intelligent people in the world and their concept of god is slightly different than most christians. Jews do not accept Jesus Christ as their promised Messiah and they definetly don't accept him as God.
I would venture to say that the Jews who inhabit the earth now probably don't accept Jesus Christ as an historical person. None of their historical data from the era Jesus lived provides any definitive answers about his existance. Of course there is the Josephus account, but most serious biblical scholars reject that piece of info as false because the original manuscript does not contain it.

To you I'm probably a fool but I have been called worse so I don't worry too much. The fear of God is not the beginning of wisdom but an open skeptical mind. Fear is an evolutionary trait inherent in all animals including us humans and is use as a survival tool for the preservation of the species.

I know most christians believe that the bible is the inspired word of god but there are those of us who beg to differ because of very good reasons. You just have to accept us just as we accept you.

I do accept you, as a matter of fact, I begining to look forward to your post.

I hope you enjoy your night and have a very Happy Independence Day:bahamas:

I read your post very carefully Truthseeker. In-fact; I make it a point to read over everything carefully and double check. This is a habit that I learned through studying the Bible. If you are wrong about something you should admit that you are wrong.

You stated in your earlier post that “Even today we see this event occuring especially in the Bahamas where politicians and religious persons conspire together to influence society to their benefit with the expectation of retaining power over the masses.”
This could only mean that the people of this time are being so-called fooled by believing in God because of the words of con artists.

If the people of that time were illiterate to accept Christ then I and everyone else who believed in God for the past few centuries must have been even stupider to accept the same Gospel. Shouldn’t we have learned from the past mistakes of our "illiterate" friends? If they were illiterate them I am illiterate and I hope to God that I will never become as smart as you are.

If you are following the world closely you would know that at this time there are more Jews who now believe in the name of Jesus Christ than at any other time in this age. And the amount of Christian Jews has skyrocketed over the past decade and they are increasing with each day. All of this is contained within the prophecy of the scriptures to prepare the world for the return of Christ. And if you don’t think that Jews are some of the smartest people in the world do a study on who owns all of the major companies all over the world, the major food chains, hotels (Sol Kerzner is a Jew), airlines and stock markets. Check out the government of the United States and count how many senators are Jews. You want to know the real reason Hitler tried to kill all of the Jews? He hated them because they owned everything in Germany at that time. Every precise diamond that has ever been cut in the history of the world was done by a Jew. The Jews were blessed by God with these talents and an acute business mind because of Abraham. We also have access to the same blessings through Jesus Christ but not many of us use it.

The fear of God is very much different from the emotion that we humans feel. The fear that I have for God is to be obedient and to acknowledge Him as Lord of my life. This is not out of fear the emotion but out of love. Human beings naturally are not afraid of God because if we were; this world would be a much better place to live.

Are you ready for solid food yet?