This mishap just goes to show how few people don't appreciate foreigners in their country and the extent goes to show how evil some of them really are. A Christian nation please!No offense but I'm a Bahamian and what happened there was nothing neigbourly about it!


The Bible teaches us to obey the laws the nation where you are residing. Most haitians are law breakers!!! We cannot offer assistance to people who do not respect the laws of this country.

Firemen who tried to quench the blaze claimed that they were attacked by Haitians. They should allowed the whole place to burn down.

In that way we can easily deport who needs to be deported and help those who qualify for help.

:jawdroop: ...and they do so in contravention of international law...remember, just as illegal immigrants are breaking domestic law, we (and the US, etc) run a serious risk of breaking international law, by immediately repatriating illegal immigrants WITHOUT screening them for asylum claims.


The US (South Florida) readily accepts cubans but sends Haitians back immediately without screening them for asylum!!! If the World does not question them, they should not question us.

The US (South Florida) readily accepts cubans but sends Haitians back immediately without screening them for asylum!!! If the World does not question them, they should not question us.


The Cubans are accepted in the US as political refugees at the urging of a massive Cuban (Republican) lobby group. Also to be able to claim that status the US has a 'wet foot / dry foot' policy in that the refugee has to set foot on US soil. If they are caught on a boat, swimming, or knee deep in water they are repatriated quickly without any real process.

First let me clear up what I said! I do not support the fact that they squatted on government property,And I believe fully in the government to enforce the laws on illegal immigrants.My only point is the outcome of someone's death please tell me your not that cold! and I don't appreciate your comment about me not being a Bahamian because I am, just not as barbaric.


bahamianz are barbarianz now?

See today's Guardian..now those who lost their homes are refusing the Governments offer to house them (temporarily) at Camp Abaco!!
I am sympathetic to their plight, but a line has to be drawn somewhere!
And by the way, I'm pretty sure that some of the land squatted on is privately owned, and the owner has tried repeatedly to claim his land....Nothing happening for him!!

See today's Guardian..now those who lost their homes are refusing the Governments offer to house them (temporarily) at Camp Abaco!!
I am sympathetic to their plight, but a line has to be drawn somewhere!
And by the way, I'm pretty sure that some of the land squatted on is privately owned, and the owner has tried repeatedly to claim his land....Nothing happening for him!!

The comment (mentioned earlier in this thread) that was made by a displaced resident was just broadcast on Cable 12:

"if people weren't around, I would a kill him"

Now bear in mind that he is talking about a fireman, a public servant. It is a volunteer position, but it's one with an official public title nonetheless. If he was that bold to say those words in front of all those other people, including official government Ministers and police officers, then I wonder what is going to happen when they start trying to repatriate the illegals living within that community.

How's that for a wake up call? I hope Ministers Gibson and Griffin shook in their shoes and passed on the message that Abaco has a major problem, right there, right now.

How many people are estimated to be in those communities - over 5000?

France een gat nuttin on what possibly could occur over there. And then - oops, U.S. travel advisory would get issued against us. And - double oops, tourism level drops.

Who dares to guess what would happen next?

The comment (mentioned earlier in this thread) that was made by a displaced resident was just broadcast on Cable 12:

"if people weren't around, I would a kill him"

Now bear in mind that he is talking about a fireman, a public servant. It is a volunteer position, but it's one with an official public title nonetheless. If he was that bold to say those words in front of all those other people, including official government Ministers and police officers, then I wonder what is going to happen when they start trying to repatriate the illegals living within that community.

How's that for a wake up call? I hope Ministers Gibson and Griffin shook in their shoes and passed on the message that Abaco has a major problem, right there, right now.

How many people are estimated to be in those communities - over 5000?

France een gat nuttin on what possibly could occur over there. And then - oops, U.S. travel advisory would get issued against us. And - double oops, tourism level drops.

Who dares to guess what would happen next?

It's going to happen anyhow,what these idiots(politicans) need to do is take the bull by the horn one time. PM Christie bout us & the haitians are watching you.

It has a lot to do with Bahamians when the public school system, as well as the other public systems in Abaco all collapse under the weight of a rapidly increasing immigrant population.
It has a lot to do with Bahamians when the government of my country has to find money to deal with the increased burden of this immigrant population when it is already dealing with a glaring budget deficit that rises every year.
It has a lot to do with Bahamians when threats of takeover and violence against us are pushed under the rug and ignored. the fact of the matter is that we are introducing an element into this society who has never known democracy.
Need I go on?
If violence against Bahamian citizens and public representatives cracks you up then so be it.
By the way, more guns are in those illegal communities than on the streets of Nassau. You probably already know this though.
Oh, so now we should develop our islands for a foreign element? Frankly, if the larger countries (like the US) who can afford to absorb them don't, what kind of logic would we be following to take on that burden?
I know that human rights is your flag to wave, but arguing a human rights cause that could potentially destabilize an already shaky country is madness.
Many Bahamian persons have ignored the warning signs out of generousity, compassion and goodwill. Now we have an element who dares to fly in the face of their saviours, but all you can argue about is the international human rights law. I guess that Bahamians do not have enough human rights to protect themselves from a known volatile element who enters their society under the guise of "hardship workers".
And we wonder why the "third world" is destined to stay "third world".

2 points: so are you saying we should introduce a 'one child' policy for immigrant population? also, i was not suggesting developing our islands for our 'foreign elements'...simply for us! get some people off of new providence! i know i said 2 points but i should also point out, we should not look to america to figure out how to treat immigrants who arrive on our shores. their guantanamo scandal is more than enough reason not to follow them...they are the MOST barbaric - they detain people indef. without a charge!

this should shut her up

...mmm no. nothing will. not even you. :fly:

2 points: so are you saying we should introduce a 'one child' policy for immigrant population?

No, but at this point an extremely restrictive permit quota needs to be established (in conjunction with international law, of course) for certain “at risk” countries. We cannot lump Haitians, Chinese, Americans, Canadians, Africans or Jamaicans together and apply one immigration rule over all of them. Our immigration laws need to be more advanced.The citizens of each of these countries present a distinctly different challenge. If records show that a country has a large immigration population base in The Bahamas already, a mandate that a work permit cannot be given for more than 5 years needs to be set, in addition to a special law that the children of the holder of this 5 year work permit are NOT eligible for citizenship. This ensures that others get the opportunity to work in this country and also limits the amount of children that they will have, knowing that they cannot simply plant themselves here permanently. They will have to leave for a specified time and return home with their spouse and any children that they've had while here. If they violate this 5 year rule and do not leave, they automatically void any future possibility of residency or citizenship. We must protect the sovereignty of our nation. We cannot expect to give out 2000-3000 NEW work permits each year to citizens of certain countries and grant their multiple children automatic citizenship without expecting our own native culture to be circumvented and replaced. Regardless of international law, a country has a right to protect its sovereignty. At this point for The Bahamas, it's a matter of National Security.

Also from this point forward, any persons found to be illegal in this country would be fingerprinted (since they have broken our laws) and are not allowed to get permits or citizenship indefinitely. This also applies to any children that they have who were born here during that illegal time period.

There is a proper procedure to be followed when asylum is applied for. This would involve immediately registering themselves at the Haitian embassy AND the Immigration Department here in Nassau once they get to our shores. Those who do not follow these guidelines are only looking to take advantage of our system and the FULL weight of the law needs to be applied to them.

Moon Angel, even the asylum law has its rules. You have been defending persons who do not want to live in full view of the rules and regulations of this Commonwealth of The Bahamas. They cannot expect to get here illegally, live for a few years and then say that they want asylum after they are caught. It doesn’t work like that. Unless they legitimately register themselves, The Bahamas has the right to send them back to the country of their origin.

also, i was not suggesting developing our islands for our 'foreign elements'...simply for us! get some people off of new providence!OK, you've clarified that, but bear in mind that major developments are in the works (or have already begun) on a few of our major islands. Bahamians will have choices within the next 5-10 years. What you're talking about has already started to happen. Look at Exuma, for example.


i know i said 2 points but i should also point out, we should not look to america to figure out how to treat immigrants who arrive on our shores. their guantanamo scandal is more than enough reason not to follow them...they are the MOST barbaric - they detain people indef. without a charge!
Yeah, but the majority of those persons at Guantanamo Bay are suspected terrorists, not immigrants. You are bringing in an argument that cannot be applied to the immigrant situation. If GB was exclusively an immigrant base, then yes, your point would be valid.

We should look to the US, because some of their systems work. I was given a work permit for that country years ago and when it expired, I made sure to get my behind off of their soil. I knew that if I stayed, that I would void any future chance of traveling to or working in that country ever again. Once people are absolutely clear of what will happen to them if they break the laws, they often follow them, if they have RESPECT for that country.

One additional point that I must make (yet again) is that we are dealing with persons who are coming from a lawless, violent society. Do we really want to openly introduce that element into these peaceful shores? As I said before, we are already seeing quite a few warnings signs. Canadians, Americans, Chinese and even Jamaicans do not have large illegal communites here in The Bahamas, nor do they present a growing threat of riotous violence. Many Bahamians are deep in denial and because of the unhindered immigrant situation we now have a generation of Bahamians of Haitian descent, some of whom have little or no loyalty to this country. They have our faces, but are being used to open the immigration gap wider for those in Haiti. Some of these "Bahamians" speak of injustice and prejudice, while simultaneously approving of the continuous flow of illegal immigrants to this nation. To date I have not seen one Haitian official who lives here or Bahamian of Haitian descent who will openly chastise their own for breaking the laws of what is now "their" country! If that's the kind of Bahamian that we have living in this society, then this problem will never be solved.

If you're Bahamian, then you are foresworn to abide by Bahamian law and to uphold those laws. Anything less is treasonous. As they say though, blood is thicker than water, so can we blame them? This why the law must do its job and harshly penalize Bahamians who attempt to thwart our immigration regulations. This country is teetering on a threshold which, once crossed, will change the face of this country forever - literally and figuratively.

My vote next election will go to the party who deals with this immigrant situation. That's the only thing that I am voting on and I'll even campaign for whatever party that solidifies a proper plan of action. That's my word.

Anything is subject to question but aren’t "laws not meant" to be enforced?
The government has no moral conviction; the Church and other organizations as such do. The convection for the government is that of the law.
No LLB needed to figure this out.

How could the government have no moral conviction when the very laws which it upholds are based on morals? Maybe, that’s what’s wrong with The Bahamas today.

Now let’s make one thing clear, I Believe that laws and regulations are essential to every society. Bottom line, people need laws to govern themselves, so, yes, laws are meant to be enforced. But that said, are all laws just? If not, what should be done about the unjust laws? Enforce them or revise them?

Let’s consider the antiquated Bahamian laws which once deemed black slaves the property of their masters, to be bought and sold indiscriminately. (For some reason I don’t think the law makers were pondering human rights here either.) So, tell me, would you have advocated upholding these supreme laws? Or perhaps you’ll agree with me that these laws were blatantly inhumane, unjust and were definitely in need of revision.

Now, am I comparing our current immigration situation to slavery, of course not. I’m merely pointing out that historically; laws have been contested and revised to reflect the basis of our nation’s moral construct.

Now let’s take a look at the government, which, according to you, can disregard individual human rights, unless of course they are “Bahamian.” Then let’s gloss over laws which deny citizenship to many who were born in the Bahamas, affording them no legal rights in their birth country. Is this just? Is it humane?


Anyone who opposes the opinion of clearing out that settlement is guilty of allowing a foreign element to openly and brazenly circumvent laws that Bahamians are harshly penalized for.

Well I guess you’ve got me pegged.

So, what should be done about the men, women and children who were left homeless?
Do we treat them with humanity and offer them assistance or as some on this thread have so adamantly suggested;
send dem back
dey een gat no business squatin on our land anyway
dey come here wid nuttin, so dey should be use to it
no, no, let’s exploit the cheap labor while we make a handsome profit…hee...hee…

After all, they are not like us, they’re the other, they aren’t Bahamains, we have no obligations to them, so what do we care right?

True The Bahamas is a small nation, which can’t absorb a huge influx of immigrants. But perhaps we need to realize that unless there is democratic stability in Haiti, we will continue to have immigrants, who’ll flee their homeland to improve their standard of living. So, simply sending them back will not discourage immigration. Look, Haitians want the same things that you and I do; education, healthcare, employment, sufficient wages (to feed their family), prosperity, peace, justice, political efficacy, etc. Now if they cant get that in their own country, then they will search for it in another, be it the Bahamas, the US, the Dominican Republic, Canada...etc

If The Bahamas really wants to decrease the influx of Haitian immigrants, perhaps, it should work closely with the Haitian Government, other Caribbean nations and UN to help stabilize the country.

The comment (mentioned earlier in this thread) that was made by a displaced resident was just broadcast on Cable 12:

"if people weren't around, I would a kill him"

Now bear in mind that he is talking about a fireman, a public servant. It is a volunteer position, but it's one with an official public title nonetheless. If he was that bold to say those words in front of all those other people, including official government Ministers and police officers, then I wonder what is going to happen when they start trying to repatriate the illegals living within that community.

How's that for a wake up call? I hope Ministers Gibson and Griffin shook in their shoes and passed on the message that Abaco has a major problem, right there, right now.

How many people are estimated to be in those communities - over 5000?

France een gat nuttin on what possibly could occur over there. And then - oops, U.S. travel advisory would get issued against us. And - double oops, tourism level drops.

Who dares to guess what would happen next?

You are perfectly correct. You see how serious that guy was, I am sure he would have killed that fireman if there was no one else around!!! Those people can be very cruel.

About 35 years ago I recall a police corporal talked about how terrible is was to see two Haitians fighting -- it was not not like how Bahamians used to fight! He said they would just take a rock or something and bash the other's head in until he was DEAD!!!

I really don't get it when some of us become so sympathetic towards persons who are breaking our laws despite the fact we are treating them so well! :confused: I bet they would NOT receive that kind of good treatment in the Dominican Republic, which is on the same island!?

It's like I have said before on similar threads: Illegals don't respect your country -- they regard us as complete fools for allowing them to be here in the first place and more so when we allow them to further break our laws!

And besides, we treat them way too well. Some on this board are probably too young or inexperienced to understand these things, but its usually not a good thing to treat people too well, even your owm family! try it and see how grateful they would be!!! :sarcastic:

I believe if we try to expatriate those people we would need to bring in some military people from the US or Jamaica for our protection! :cry:

So, what should be done about the men, women and children who were left homeless?

Like Moon Angel says, we process those who are eligible for asylum and the rest would be sent back.

This country has no obligation to those people. Haiti's government has failed them, not ours. The Bahamas cannot continue to bear the burden of a larger, poorer nation and attempting to do so will only lead to this nation's financial, economical and social demise!


Do we treat them with humanity and offer them assistance
Yes, but only those who legally come to our shores and/ or apply for asylum immediately upon entering this country.


send dem back
Yes

dey een gat no business squatin on our land anyway
ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!
dey come here wid nuttin, so dey should be use to it
What they really should be doing is fighting for their rights in HAITI, not fighting for rights in a foreign land! This isn't their country!
no, no, let’s exploit the cheap labor while we make a handsome profit…hee...hee…
Absolutely not
After all, they are not like us, they’re the other, they aren’t Bahamains, we have no obligations to them, so what do we care right?
It isn't about not caring. It is about knowing the limitations of a small nation of people who have struggled for a successful democracy on OUR OWN.

Hardship exists all over this world. Too many countries are focused exclusively on piggy-backing on the success of others, while they allow their own country to live in squalor, filth, violence and corruption.

In the same way that you do not help every beggar that you see on the street, is the same way that this country cannot expect to help every immigrant who enters this nation. They can do better. They have a positive future in Haiti, if they put their feet down and are willing to fight for it, in that country.


So, simply sending them back will not discourage immigration. Look, Haitians want the same things that you and I do; education, healthcare, employment, sufficient wages (to feed their family), prosperity, peace, justice, political efficacy, etc. Now if they cant get that in their own country, then they will search for it in another, be it the Bahamas, the US, the Dominican Republic, Canada...etc


No, this is an argument of defeatism. Sending them back WILL discourage immigration after the word gets out that once they are caught (and are not eligible for asylum), they are fingerprinted and can never come back to the Bahamas to work or visit. It'll work, believe me.

These are harsh measures that must be implemented as soon as possible along with drastically increased fines for those who employ or house illegal workers. The time to implement these solutions is NOW!

"special circumstances"???? what special circumstances? no such defense exists in the application of international refugee law. our immigration situation is indeed a crisis...but it does not justify us trivialising and ignoring our international obligations. should have considered that before we signed the convention.
i'm not saying we can 'absorb haiti', or solve its problems, simply that, as we repatriate, there are certain legal provisions we must respect - which at this point, we do not. as for the constant line of reasoning that we are simply 'too small' - think if countries like pakistan and iran - very much overpopulated - who have had to take millions of afghan refugees during the soviet invasion. think of african countries who are forced to absorb their neighbours due to ongoing violent conflicts. im not saying we have the space, all im saying is that some have had it far worse...we should perhaps develop some of our 700 uninhabitated islands and cays!

Goodness, gracious! This is really bending over backwards WAY too far!!!

I for one would rather break or smash that so-called International law into smithereens and suffer the consequences than allow a bunch of rag tag illegals to completely destroy our Bahamaland! No way Hosay!!!

Why should we imitate those other countries who allowed themselves to become overcrowded!? We'd be even fooler than they to follow their example.

I can't for the life of me understand why we should obey a law which would or could eventually allow our country to be ruined!!! :dgi: