I seriously wonder about the future of our Bahamian music culture... Is it dieing out? Where will it be in the next 12-15 years... there is not really any national acceptance from the younger generation for our own style of musical expression.... DOES this not worry any one but me..... What do you want your grandchildren to hear when they reach into this world that we once had a type of music that further individualized us as Bahamians but it has since faded away....
Bahamian Music is one of the most unique style of music known in these times… it reaches an artistic level practiced by no other county ( that I know of personally) . Using talents such as combining ol-folk stories and tons of rhythmic analogies that are uniquely recognized by Bahamian people…. All of this…. All of this… all of this is just blowing over our heads like the wind.
Like most of you (that may reply in agreement and/or disagreement) I have a deep admiration for our Bahamian culture and I think that we all need to play our small role in this much larger project of preserving our history, culture and of course to preserve the topic under discussion OUR BAHAMIAN MUSIC….. Please give me some hope… don’t be shy tell what you think about this matter.

I seriously wonder about the future of our Bahamian music culture... Is it dieing out? Where will it be in the next 12-15 years... there is not really any national acceptance from the younger generation for our own style of musical expression.... DOES this not worry any one but me..... What do you want your grandchildren to hear when they reach into this world that we once had a type of music that further individualized us as Bahamians but it has since faded away....
Bahamian Music is one of the most unique style of music known in these times… it reaches an artistic level practiced by no other county ( that I know of personally) . Using talents such as combining ol-folk stories and tons of rhythmic analogies that are uniquely recognized by Bahamian people…. All of this…. All of this… all of this is just blowing over our heads like the wind.
Like most of you (that may reply in agreement and/or disagreement) I have a deep admiration for our Bahamian culture and I think that we all need to play our small role in this much larger project of preserving our history, culture and of course to preserve the topic under discussion OUR BAHAMIAN MUSIC….. Please give me some hope… don’t be shy tell what you think about this matter.



Interesting thread, and I'm surprise that it did not get as many replies. However, Bahamian music in it's purest form has lost it's edge to many young people in my opinion. I feel that the music has lost some of its zest and appeal. Mainly because of the revolution of other genres of music of time. In other words, in the formative of native Bahamian music, there were sounds of R&B, Rock n' Roll, and Raggae. Now in 2005, all of those forms of music underwent dramatic change EXCEPT Bahamian music. To me, I appreciate the music and it's history, but in a world or immense variety, and millions of sounds, there has not been an enhancement of Bahamian music to take it into the 21st Century. That's just my opinion, of course there's a ton more I can add like (how much money can you make from Bahamian music), but I'll leave it as that.

Many younger Bahamians don't care for our music until they live away from home for a while. That's when their true appreciation kicks in.

It isn't dying out yet, but more international exposure does need to occur. Bahamian music needs to get out of the confines of these shores and spread its wings - Not like how Bahamen did it either. Those guys have skills in their own right, but their sound has settled too much into popular US culture.

We need to globally market some hardcore rake and scrape or Goombay. The world wants to hear something different, so let's give it to them. They might not undertand what we are saying, but give it to 'em anyway.

Once it takes off around the globe, then Bahamians will appreciate it here at home. Ronnie Butler's recent success with "Reserve a Place" in Cuba shows that we can start with the Latino market. Ba Da Bing! Miami is right next door.

The possibilities are endless if the right people can put their heads together. Foreigners love Bahamian music - it's us Bahamians who have to be convinced of this fact.

So here is a question, we know or, pretty much have an Idea of what is the problem... my question is well who is to blame?

It isn't dying out yet, but more international exposure does need to occur. Bahamian music needs to get out of the confines of these shores and spread its wings - Not like how Bahamen did it either. Those guys have skills in their own right, but their sound has settled too much into popular US culture.




Yup, because that's what sells. Record companies do not care about who you are or what you feel is the right way to go w/ your music. They are only concerned about what's going to sell millions of records. You don't think that Bahamen made mention of Rake N' Scrape when they were in the limelight? I think so, but when A&R personnel sits down to listen to material, they listen for image, sound, and quality of music. Yeah, you can spend $15,000 producing Bahamian music, but can you make a $5,000 profit world wide??? I don't think so.

Look at our artists, then look at their vocal performance, look at their song writing skills. We are good at Bahamian FOLK music, that stays and lives in the Bahamas, and a few places outside the Bahamas, and that's about it.

Think about it. If you you could get a record deal worth $200,000 from Sony or Motown, or RCA records doing Bahamian music, you don't think more Bahamias would have gotten involved and contributed more to the industry???


As far as who's to blame, I really do not know. I surely wished that the powers that be had the insight to make the music more attractive, but that's a catch 22 in itself, because if you take away or add anything to the music, people will question its authenticity, maybe that's why it's been the same sounding music for half a centruy now.

Yeah, you can spend $15,000 producing Bahamian music, but can you make a $5,000 profit world wide??? I don't think so.
Look at our artists, then look at their vocal performance, look at their song writing skills. We are good at Bahamian FOLK music, that stays and lives in the Bahamas, and a few places outside the Bahamas, and that's about it.
Think about it. ?
As far as who's to blame, I really do not know. I surely wished that the powers that be had the insight to make the music more attractive, but that's a catch 22 in itself, because if you take away or add anything to the music, people will question its authenticity, maybe that's why it's been the same sounding music for half a centruy now.



You know what I have somewhat researched this matter... and I think that you’re right the powers to be should be the ones to make the first step... I mean just nearly 15 some odd years ago Bahamian artist had to battle with the ZNS cooperation just to get more of there own material played... and now the industry is trying to expand it's borders and yet still our own people slow us down.. For example (promotions) Ronnie Butler's new video had got the boot from the Bahamas broadcasting cooperation... and I have seen it my self and I don't think that is in anyway unacceptable. I mean I don't know who runs ZNS and such cooperation’s but the ol heads that make unnecessary barriers for the development of our own culture needs to retire.


Yeah yeah every one says that Bahamian artist needs to take our music here (foreign) and take our music there (elsewhere) but that’s probably damn near impossible seeing that they can’t even take there music to there own countries broadcasting community… why bother then…. You think that other artist in other countries have such a hard time in receiving the attention from there own or even better... do you think that such evolutions of genres such as Soca and Reggae could have gotten anywhere if there own people did not accept and love there own music first.

My theory about this evolution concept is that we all need to fully embrace our music FIRST>>>>>. Then after which take this abroad>>>>>, and then you would see more people getting involved in our musical culture >>>>>and then you would see this “evolution” occur.

Believe me when I say this. Bahamians are the source for the demise for our country, and our people. The state in which we are today, is a direct result of Bahamian influence. And it hurts me to say that. I have the upmost respect for Ronnie, KB, Ira Storr and the rest of those artists who continue to create, because life as a musician in the Bahamas is VERY difficult, and it is very easy to give up and walk away.

In Jamaica, you can have have a career as a Jamacian artist, meaning FULL-TIME, 24/7, you write songs, and create music, how many Bahamian artists can brag of that luxury in their own country? I would dare say that 98% of Bahamian artists have a SECOND JOB or Regular job. Mainly because we in the Bahamas look at the music profession as a hobby, rather than an acutal career. And that's really sad.


Therefore, no one will take you seriously.


:realmad:

This what you say is true... but my friend (g2) is this right I mean should it be this way, I mean I have seen some "Bahamian artist" and trust me you would never think of them to be in state that there in but it is shamefull to see what could have been a potential great product due to overwhelming support from there own.. have some artist looking like they starving for attention. I think that this is sad and personally I feel sorry for the industry, but definately I must say it takes a lot of nerve to persue that business... it's a very risky market.

This what you say is true... but my friend (g2) is this right I mean should it be this way, I mean I have seen some "Bahamian artist" and trust me you would never think of them to be in state that there in but it is shamefull to see what could have been a potential great product due to overwhelming support from there own.. have some artist looking like they starving for attention. I think that this is sad and personally I feel sorry for the industry, but definately I must say it takes a lot of nerve to persue that business... it's a very risky market.



I really can not express the way I feel to see the neglect, and substandard treatment that our artists receive, and then to turn my head to the left and see sponser after sponser, promoter after promoter chase to spend hundreds of thousands of dollars to bring a Jamacian artist to our shores. This should not be.

Absolutely disheartening!

:tdown:

i've been meaning to post on this thread but havent for fear that i would go on a mad tyrade for about half a century and i have schoolwork to do... i barely know where to begin....
i guess i'll start by saying that all the young bahamian ppl who claim they don't love bahamian music tell a big boldface lie... some may disagree with my assertion but i have watched time and time again at school dances, clubs, boatcruises, parties and weddings the very same thing happen.... the dj plays a little R&B... then some rap... maybe some oldschool reggae to warm the crowd up... some ppl start dancin.... play lil reggae for a bit.... then back to the hiphop.... and one gang a ppl sit down... females that is... the males dere boppin like dey'n gat no sense til they realise the dance floor is a balls out.... then they put on soca and a buncha females go runnin back to the dance floor to get on bad... and den for some strange reason the dj goes back to whatever is the most popular rap song... ppl sit again... n dey pissed off now cuz tings was jammin... ppl callin out bout 'kill da dj'... and he know it's only one thing to do to save himself, esp on a boatcruise (that is a lot of water to go get lost in).... all ya hear is 'who in da mornin!!! ROOTS' or some other junkanoo or rake n scrape n den da floor flooded... ppl who wasnt dancin i mean like it's boxing day mornin.... and da dj save he life.... this used to piss me off to no end when i was in high school because the same ppl hoo would go up there and i mean totally lose themselves in it would be right there on monday mornin ostracizing me and my friends when we start gettin passionate about ronnie butler or ira storr.... :hot: ooohhh dat used to make me mad...
then i after i graduated i was around the music scene in nassau a lot and found that a good portion of the guys doing music had their hearts set on rap... i mean, wow... all i could think was wow... what the hell is this... a buncha young bahamian boys rappin like they live in a big city surrounded by concrete.... oh... and let me not forget my bahamian brothers who got caught up in the reggae and dancehall thing.... sighz... honestly, what the hell??now, i'll admit... i ended up becoming a part of rap scene... i just wanted to play music... got sick and quit tho....
no one of any consequence seemed to really take the whole scene seriously and in my estimation no one really had anything to say... at least if the lyrics were solid then u could jive with it.... but i digress....
it's just that it infuriates me whenever i go and talk with my parents or grandparents and their friends... and they talk about back in the day with the cat n the fiddle and the silver slipper and all kinda places that i mean were downright famous.... we were a major stop on the music circuit back in the day and we had artist pun artist pun artist who had the musical chops to hang out with nat king cole n dem... and was jammin bahamian music...
i mean... y'all kno exuma the obeah man used to hang out with jimi hendrix in greenwich village? or that joseph spence, a bahamian guitarist (KRAZY guitar mind, check it out fa real, u'll swear it's 3 men playin) he was the one who one of the biggest inspirations for bob dylan... there would be no legend named bob dylan if it wasnt for him... but no one teaches us that.... he was a pioneer in folk music and is celebrated all over north america but bahamians have no idea who he is.... instead of teaching us about george symonette amd mary duvalier in music class we were learnin australian folk songs!! WHAT?! so much for bahamianization.........
even the radio stations get on my nerves.... i mean, at one point they were goin on about who had the best hour of bahamian music.... like they were supposed to get an award for playing local music.... thank God for charles carter and island 102.9fm.... i thank you every day mr. carter...
but i understand why ppl dont check for our music at home like that... i mean, it hasnt really evolved like other genres as mentioned in another's post... which i think is a pro and a con... on the one hand it means that our musical style is preserved.... that's a part of our culture that's still very rich.... need to go buy me a saw now that i think bout it........... but on the other hand you have a bunch of generations who feel like they can't relate to it because the lyrics don't necessarily reflect what's going on in there lives... as a friend pointed out.... age ain nuthin but a number is a great song... but i can't necessarily relate... i think i ga get me a banjo first tho...
now when i said that the music hasnt evolved i meant not the way that r&b turned into hiphop, or blues into rock into whatever it is they have on now (i really just don't know how to classify your ashley simpson for example)... but it can be said that the young ppl tied to those genres took them and morphed them into an attitude in sound that is relevant to their time without changing the fundamentals.... you can hear motown in rap music, and modern rock for that matter.... and it's still only 3 chords they're chuggin away at to make rock n roll hits.... the same has not happened with rake n scrape really.... not yet anywayz.... i feel like that's the only way to bring younger folks back to it.... i mean, try sit back and appreciate our music for one... and then write songs about now... with an attitude that reflects our attitudes towards things now... a friend of mine... well i'm not sure he still considers me a friend anymore because of how heated our arguments on this very same subject would get... but he would alwayz say, 'man, it jes too... too... it jes to happy man... i hate it'.... i dont think he meant that the music should be sad or angry.... but we are more aggressive in the way we deal with each other... the music should reflect that, while retaining it's bahamianicity (yea... i made that word up... what?!)
sighz... but once again i digress... i just want to end by saying this (cuz i kinda ran on).... i'm not full of hot air running on about this and not doing anything... i'm a young songwriter and musician.... and i'm not saying my work is great... but i'm trying... and i'm trying to keep it bahamian... cuz quite honestly i love it... i just love rake n scrape and if it died i'd die 2...

It's funny how you said that your friend said that our music is too happy.. blah blah blah....And it's true we do have a more up tempo, uplifting tone... and you would think that we as a generation would love this... My question is this .. who is really to blame... I mean to be honest, I blame our people before hand... they have just as much responsiblity for passing this part of our culture on as our responsibility to learn this (i mean I would not want my son/dauther to grow up not knowing our culture.) ... ..Buddi I know and feel the same way you do.. but trust me I am so fed up with this I could go on for pages of writing... but this is why I started this thread... because .. I really want to know what other bahamians feel.. I mean does this not bother anyone... this site gets on average 20 views a day and not one of them reply to this... this makes me wonder... is it that bahamians don't care that a part of the culture is being washed away or is it that they to themselves have a thing against our happy music.

I went to this club in San Salvador (Club Juice) one Friday night. Normally disco music is played but the manager decide to have a Bahamian night and hired a local band to play. The band was very good, one of the members use to play with J Mitchell, one with Soulful Groovers and the others played in various bands in Nassau. The disco kicked off about 9pm and the place was jamming. At about 10:30 the band started and those young folks literally ran that band out of the club. They were shouting and screaming, "Shoot the Band, Send them to bed, and all sorts of F*** names. By 11:00 they all left and went to another club leaving only a few older folks and some guests from Club Med. It was embarrassing especially to the band members. Our younger generations really don't appreciate Bahamian artists and their music.

half the time when things like that happen i wonder if it's just because it's kewl not to like our music... or anything bahamian for that matter... followin the bandwagon... ya dun had couple drinks in ya.... that's really sad to hear... i woulda love to been to that show...
i also blame the ppl beforehand.... for this whole music situation... for the watering down of the national syllabus... for not giving us an adequate history of our country and for not fostering a real rawbone sense of national pride in these younger generations... i feel like we've been left to grow wild, while the big ppl go around playing politrickster... per capita we have an insane amount of talent in so many areas but especially in music... how many church bands and school bands and just bands are there? how many horns and wind instruments and drummz are out there on junkanoo mornin? and how many more aren't simply because they don't belong to a group or didnt show up to practice regularly enough?
our police band and the defence force band and the national youth choir always goin somewhere again.... obviously someone out there in the wider world wants to see it.... i don't see why we are so against something that could be quite a reasonably sized revenue source for the country...
sighz.... i could feel i am gonna start runnin on once again so i am out....
yall take it easy still...
peace....

wow man thats some messed up sh:taped: yo... San Sal is carryon like that

I am SOOOOO happy that I found this group. Is shows that this topic has become important enough for young Bahamians to discuss with passion.

I've been in this fight for many years as a musician and as a Bahamian at heart.

We have sooo many issues to deal with before we can get dis ting on track.

Firstly, we have to bring back the Bahamian pride and not only show it when someone wins a national event. We have to be Bahamians all the time just like the Jamaicans and Bajans and Trinis love themselves. This is another discussion for another time.

However, we need to determine what we really want to call 'our' music. So many of us refer to soca as our music. Maybe this is because this is because we hear so much of it. We even refer to the music by Ronnie Butler and others as Soca.

There is a distinct difference musically and we have failed to educate ourselves to the difference.

I do not believe that we have to be focused on taking our music foreign. WE don't have to be judged by someone else's yard stick. We have 300,000 persons living here with the majority loving our music when it's given to them properly.

Check out 'Burma Road', Look What You Do, Get Involved, Civil Servant, Catch Da Crab etc, etc, etc. Don't the Bahamian public love this music?

So if we get together and market and promote these artists locally and sell to only $100,000 of them at $10 per CD there is $1,000,000.00 floating out there.

So there are some fundamental things that we have to do before we can make a firm difference.

We have to set some cultural boundaries which affect our music, junkanoo, food, dialect etc. and then we'll see da difference.

Will watch for the replies and then I'll post some more.