Do you think that it will be beneficial for the Bahamas to join the Caribbean Single Market Economy?

Lock in your Votes Now!

There are no real benefits for the bahamas to join CSME. The Bahamas must be careful not to fall into the trap of going all with the crowd.

Barf

I think there ought to be greater effort at educating and sensitizing us about the benefits and long term affects before we can make a decision. What we certainly do not need, is for fear and ignorance to make this such a sensational matter that we hinder the average Bahamian from making an informed decision.

It is simply to early to answer, we need to exercise careful consideration.

The issue of the Bahamas being apart of CSME is not a new one but has been around for awhile. CARICOM has put its deadline for the CSME aspects at 2005. Whilst, we do not object to the entire CSME proposal, we reject out right the free movement of professional workers. We feel this will undermine our own work force. Further, we are of the opinion, that it is discriminatory for CORICOM members to limit movement to simply professionals or degreed persons. What do you think would be the outcome of a discrimination case brought in our sister Caribbean islands and decided on by a new Caribbean Court of Appeal? It will simply mean that all CSME signatories would have to open their borders to all workers. The question is, can the Bahamas afford that? What happens when Haiti is added to the mix?

The CSME also allows for free movement of capital out of the Bahamas. For example if a professional sets up here, and they want to move their money back to their country, the Central Bank of the Bahamas will not be engaged. Compare this to us, where we are restricted by exchange controls on the basis that it secures our 'reserves' does this mean it will destabilize us?

We can join, but reserve the above aspects along with tariff provisions...but they do not want that. So you have to ask the question whether joining is in the best interest of the Bahamas and we believe the answer is NO...not at this time!

Yes to CSME !
With any International Treaty , the Bahamas needs to consider its position very carefully,before accepting or rejecting it.
It goes without saying it that the CSME will be a Major challenge to the Bahamas over the next few years. In my opinion the Bahamas ,right now has no choice but to join. And the sooner we join the better it would be for us down the road.
Now, to join does not mean that we agree to everything that is being advocated by the others in the group. As I see it the Bahamas needs to stay engaged with everyone in the Group so that those things that are to our advantage are emphasized and those not to our advantage are minimized.
In the current round of debate it seems that only the " free movement of Labour " provision of the treaty is getting all the attention of the media. Well this is somewhat short-sighted , but so be it, the publis discussion is good even if it is limited to this aspect of the treaty.
It is obvious to anyone concerned that this provision of the treaty as being touted , is unacceptable to the majority of Bahamians, particularly the most vulnerable of the society i.e. the working class. To them free movement of labour means a flood of cheap labour from our poorer carribean brothers. Our Politicians are therefore unable to deal with it rationally. But Why cant we push for a modified free movement treaty. Why should we not negotiate a qouta system that sets a limit on the numbers moving in any one period. This would prevent, or certainly , lessen any shock to our economy. and give us time to adjust to increased numbers. the beauty of a quota system is that the initial numbers can be set very low and be allowed to escalate as our respective economies grow accustomed to the system.
We can call for longer transition periods say to 2010 for full implementation of any agreed scheme. We need not accept 2005.
There are so many provisions in the treaty that we can and should negotiate,with the full participation of the Public at large that I cant see the Government making a decision to not sign at this time ... It is better to sign with "Resevations" than to be left out of the process by refusing to sign.
The world is in a state now that no Nation will be allowed to stand alone.

The Bahamas cannot unilaterally "reserve" parts of the CSME Agreement. The Bahamas will have to be very creative because if countries could simply "reserve", it will make nonsense out of the agreement. Similarly, the Bahamas cannot put its own time table on this agreement. There are actually only a few issues that we believe restricts the Bahamas from signing as seen in our last text. They are however very major issues which go to the heart of CSME and as a result the Bahamas in all likelihood will not opt to be apart of it. In the ideal world, we could have made these reservations. Frankly, CARICOM will have none of that and so we must do it without them as they will without us.

www.barfbahamas.org

Let's not make a big issue out of something that is so simple to the naked eyes seem so complicated. There might be allot of things involved in the CSME scheme "yes I said scheme" but common sense shows us Bahamians that this is bad news for us. The Bahamas is too sophisticated to allow a bunch of third world nations to coerce us into joining something that benefits them and not us. We here in the Bahamas hardly produce any goods that we can trade with the Caribbean. We are a country based on services, not the production of goods. We make our money through Tourism and Banking, not farming or fishing. Other Caribbean nations aren't as fortunate as we are and that’s why they are jumping into this headfirst. Its obvious their leaders has realized that they all are going down slowly and this is a Do-or-Die situation, so they will like to get this going A.S.A.P. Why should we fix what isn't broken? If we are doing fine the way we are why change anything?
The only nations the Bahamas should join in ranks with are the U.S.A., Canada, Western Europe.... etc.etc and other prosperous nations that can teach us more and help us advance even further. No offence to the Caribbean but I see like this. Lets say, that I am a "B" student, and my teacher told the classroom assemble a couple of teams to present a research paper explaining the necessity of physics to man and explain calculus as source of advancement to engineers. Would it make more sense to join ranks with people who are failing or the ones at an "A" level?
Why should we join ranks with a bunch of nations that has proven they are nothing but failures? Yes we would be leader of the pack but we wouldn't be the beneficiaries. If the leaders of the Caribbean want us to hop aboard this sloop that is patched together with bubblegum and tape they should show us a clear cut example of how beneficial this is to us and how minor the consequences would be.
And also our workforce should have reservations about foreign workers coming here because they will work for cheep, they will do whatever to bring all of their families here and a professional in Haiti, Jamaica, or anywhere else in the region is not necessarily a professional in the Bahamas.

:bahamas:

while I fully understand the concerns articulated in "bad news bahamas" notwithstanding the disparaging references to the "bunch of third world nations...that have proven they are nothing but failures", common sense, economic theory and globalisation all support the fact that if the Bahamas does not join the CSME and by extension the FTAA, it will in fact be left behind.

You cannot have your cake and eat it too. If "sophisticated" Bahamians feel they are above the CSME they should not be in CARICOM. Perhaps they should follow the example of the Dominican Republic and enter into separate trade agreements with the rest of the hemisphere as well as CARICOM. But, the Bahamas cannot reap the benefits of sharing an economic space -- an instant market -- of millions of people without some sort of compromise.

The CSME is but one step in a series of steps towards HEMISPHERIC integration -- integration that includes economies MUCH more developed than that of the "sophicated" Bahamas i.e. the United States, Canada, Mexico, and Brazil. Moreover, the CSME is also negotiating with the EU. It would be more difficult for the Bahamas to succeed in separate side negotiations (sophistication notwithstanding) with these major economic players.

The concerns of the Bahamians regarding the CSME are not unlike those of the British regarding the European Union. Yet, even the Brits realise that they must soon join the European Union as prices of goods and services in the UK continue to rise while those in the EU are declining. Even the Brits have already aligned themselves with integration as they comply with the policies, laws and regulations that come down from Brussels.

Can you imagine the economic strength of a seamlessly integrated region that has the bauxite of Jamaica, Guyana and Surinam; the gold and diamonds of Guyana; the oil and natural gas of Trinidad; the toruism infrastructure of Jamaica and Barbados; the agricultural capabilities of Dominica and St. Lucia; and the services industry of a SOPHISTICATED Bahamas??? Can you imagine that??? The Caribbean region (including Cuba) has the HIGHEST literacy rate in the entire hemisphere and one of the highest literacy rates in the world. The reason each of these countries have not been as successful as they might have been is due to lack of economy of scale. You think the Bahamas is doing well now? What do you think would happen if its service industry could benefit from an economic space of approx. 14 million people?!?

The Caribbean does not have to worry about war, famine, disease, poverty and the other ailments that have hindered progress in other resource rich parts of the world such as Africa. Think about the modern day success of places like Singapore that have boomed with so little. Why couldn't/wouldn't we be the same?

It's time to put all this petty regionalism and tribalism behind us. I thought we were more sophisticated than that. Aren't we mature enough to realise that no situation, including the CSME will ever be perfect? Nationalism is a good thing -- don't get me wrong-- but, nationalism at the expense of pushing the nation forward is nothing but detrimental. There is strength in numbers. Together we can be heard and we can resist the tendency to become the puppets of American puppeteers. And, if the Bahamas is as sophisticated as prevailing thought, it will realise this sooner rather than later.

Life is like carnival -- you can either join the procession or stand and look on from the side, just realise that once the procession passes it's hell trying to catch up.

There are many things to consider before such an action should be taken. The first and most important is whetehr our government as currently constituted "Westminister System" can seroiusly debate this. Our governing basis is seriously flawed, and any decisions renedered therefrom would likewise be flawed.

We have inherited an antiquated system that is not in step with the times. There is no government in the sunshine unless the rule of government is less subject to the all powerful PM....no matter the party in power. The few statesmen that have arisen from our current system were beaten down by the system itself with its propensity for allowing/encouraging corruption in the body politic.

We need a saviour of immense proportions from a governing standpoint. We need a statesmen who can afford to govern, and not be swayed by the wills of those that are there to enrich themselves exclusively. Yes , it is time to throw rocks at the old system and find us a leader, in or out of government that would seriously represent that.

We need a "No Strings Government " as per Dr Harlington "H" Hanna article at
http://www.hannaian.com

Dr. H gives a masterful insight into the magnanmimous weakness of the current system as it relates to all of the trade agreements being considered at this time. The "mindframe" needed to make such decisions in ways that all can live with does not exist in the current political paradigm .

In a manner of speaking, if these trade decisions were made today in the current environment, and we then go on and allow the same polical cronyism to continue to exist, then no matter the qualification for the job, contract, or whatever by Bahamians or outsiders, it still boils down to who knows you, or whom you can afford to pay.

In a report rendered by the IMF in 2003, the Bahamas was listed as number 1 in terms of governmnet corruption...reference The Nassau Institute Think Tank. The bi-cameral government that was "thrusted" upon us in 1973 as a good one to continue has served only to effectively poison two complete generations on the notion of work. The youth of the past two generations upon looking at our politicians graft themselves from nothing to millionaire status in sometimes a short as one political terms had serious long term implications for them.

Seriously study the bi-cameral system with this appointed/elected leader (PM) with the accompanying rubberstamp senate, and tell me that you don't see both too much opportunity for corruption, and no desire for change. The populace is effectively hooded , and are being walked to economic slaughter. Ask any Minister of Parliament or elected representative of the inherrent weakness of this system, then study and cross examine his/her response.

A better discussion/understanding of this can be garnered from Attorney/Dr. Harlington "H" Hanna of the same at http://www.hannaian.com

You'll find there that there are definite things that can be done , and that this problem that is endemic to the Caribbean is being solved elsewhere in the BWI and is being seroiusly considered in the Bahamas.

Out,
Princebh

What concerns me the most about joining the CSME is that our dollar value is very strong (the same as the US dollar), and if/when we join the CSME our dollar value may have to drop. Other caribbean countries; even though they have vast natural resources and landscapes even more beautiful than ours the value of their dollar is very weak compared to ours (yes even Brazil, Trinidad& Tobago and Mexico). If we keep up to date with whats going on around the world we would see that Britian is faced with a similiar situation. While they agree in principle to a European single currency (the euro), they are very reluctant to join because the British pound has the strongest dollar value in the world today. Joining the european single currency would decrease the value of the pound. the Bahamas is very fortunate to enjoy such economic stability almost solely as the result of the tourism market. What we need to concentrate on is improving our tourism product in order to remain competitive when the rest of the world become aware that there are better vacation and business destinations (imagine if Cuba were to be lifted off US sanctions).
I think that we should use the Bahamian government's mistake in the banking sector as an example. The bank secrecy laws that the government succomed to was totally unnecessary, and as a result our nations second most lucrative industry is on the verge of collaspe. Everyday more and more banks are closing, some of which have been in operation in our country for decades. Some countries like the Cayman islands and even Switzerland (who happens to be on the world commitee which requested the sanctions) did not comply with these bank secrecy laws and are now experiencing an exponential growth in their banking industry.
Just last week the WTO talks in Cancun Mexico broke down because the smaller third world countries realised that they cannot compete in agriculture and trade with larger countries (mainly the US) who make sure that their products are the first (and cheapest) to reach the markets. The Bahamas should continue to trade with all countries as this compeetition will hopefully bring cheaper prices (at least thats the theory behind privatization ie Batelco). If the government is really serious about the FTAA and CSME then why don't they try and develop an agricultural and industrial industry so that we can have something to offer the rest of the caribbean and the world besides sun sand and sea. And by the way, the rest of the caribbean do experience poverty. Countries like Jamica and even Brazil are a prime example.
while I fully understand the concerns articulated in "bad news bahamas" notwithstanding the disparaging references to the "bunch of third world nations...that have proven they are nothing but failures", common sense, economic theory and globalisation all support fact that if the Bahamas does not join the CSME and by extension the FTAA, it will in fact be left behind.

You cannot have your cake and eat it too. If "sophisticated" Bahamians feel they are above the CSME they should not be in CARICOM. Perhaps they should follow the example of the Dominican Republic and enter into separate trade agreements with the rest of the hemisphere as well as CARICOM. But, the Bahamas cannot reap the benefits of sharing an economic space -- an instant market -- of millions of people without some sort of compromise.

The CSME is but one step in a series of steps towards HEMISPHERIC integration -- integration that includes economies MUCH more developed than that of the "sophicated" Bahamas i.e. the United States, Canada, Mexico, and Brazil. Moreover, the CSME is also negotiating with the EU. It would be more difficult for the Bahamas to succeed in separate side negotiations (sophistication notwithstanding) with these major economic players.

The concerns of the Bahamians regarding the CSME are not unlike those of the British regarding the European Union. Yet, even the Brits realise that they must soon join the European Union as prices of goods and services in the UK continue to rise while those in the EU are declining. Even the Brits have already aligned themselves with integration as they comply with the policies, laws and regulations that come down from Brussels.

Can you imagine the economic strength of a seamlessly integrated region that has the bauxite of Jamaica, Guyana and Surinam; the gold and diamonds of Guyana; the oil and natural gas of Trinidad; the toruism infrastructure of Jamaica and Barbados; the agricultural capabilities of Dominica and St. Lucia; and the services industry of a SOPHISTICATED Bahamas??? Can you imagine that??? The Caribbean region (including Cuba) has the HIGHEST literacy rate in the entire hemisphere and one of the highest literacy rates in the world. The reason each of these countries have not been as successful as they might have been is due to lack of economy of scale. You think the Bahamas is doing well now? What do you think would happen if its service industry could benefit from an economic space of approx. 14 million people?!?

The Caribbean does not have to worry about war, famine, disease, poverty and the other ailments that have hindered progress in other resource rich parts of the world such as Africa. Think about the modern day success of places like Singapore that have boomed with so little. Why couldn't/wouldn't we be the same?

It's time to put all this petty regionalism and tribalism behind us. I thought we were more sophisticated than that. Aren't we mature enough to realise that no situation, including the CSME will ever be perfect? Nationalism is a good thing -- don't get me wrong-- but, nationalism at the expense of pushing the nation forward is nothing but detrimental. There is strength in numbers. Together we can be heard and we can resist the tendency to become the puppets of American puppeteers. And, if the Bahamas is as sophisticated as prevailing thought, it will realise this sooner rather than later.

Life is like carnival -- you can either join the procession or stand and look on from the side, just realise that once the procession passes it's hell trying to catch up.

What are the Advantages and Disadvantages of the Bahamas joining the CSME?!?!..someone please answer that because from readin the posts i'm not gettin a clear answer :confused: :confused: :confused:

i think so.....

ity wouldnt hurt!!!:D

while I fully understand the concerns articulated in "bad news bahamas" notwithstanding the disparaging references to the "bunch of third world nations...that have proven they are nothing but failures", common sense, economic theory and globalisation all support the fact that if the Bahamas does not join the CSME and by extension the FTAA, it will in fact be left behind.

You cannot have your cake and eat it too. If "sophisticated" Bahamians feel they are above the CSME they should not be in CARICOM. Perhaps they should follow the example of the Dominican Republic and enter into separate trade agreements with the rest of the hemisphere as well as CARICOM. But, the Bahamas cannot reap the benefits of sharing an economic space -- an instant market -- of millions of people without some sort of compromise.

First off all most Bahamians doesn't want to be affiliated with the CARICOM!

The CSME is but one step in a series of steps towards HEMISPHERIC integration -- integration that includes economies MUCH more developed than that of the "sophicated" Bahamas i.e. the United States, Canada, Mexico, and Brazil. Moreover, the CSME is also negotiating with the EU. It would be more difficult for the Bahamas to succeed in separate side negotiations (sophistication notwithstanding) with these major economic players.

Second of all you shouldn't even mention Mexico with the rest of those sophisticatd Nations. That country has some serious economic problems going on and being a part of NAFTA didn't help them as they expected. It made lots of things worst in exchange for less things better.

The concerns of the Bahamians regarding the CSME are not unlike those of the British regarding the European Union. Yet, even the Brits realise that they must soon join the European Union as prices of goods and services in the UK continue to rise while those in the EU are declining. Even the Brits have already aligned themselves with integration as they comply with the policies, laws and regulations that come down from Brussels.

Third of all things, if Britain gave into the the European Union theres not much fear when you consider the educational background and Intelegence of those associated with the European Union.

Can you imagine the economic strength of a seamlessly integrated region that has the bauxite of Jamaica, Guyana and Surinam; the gold and diamonds of Guyana; the oil and natural gas of Trinidad; the toruism infrastructure of Jamaica and Barbados; the agricultural capabilities of Dominica and St. Lucia; and the services industry of a SOPHISTICATED Bahamas??? Can you imagine that??? The Caribbean region (including Cuba) has the HIGHEST literacy rate in the entire hemisphere and one of the highest literacy rates in the world. The reason each of these countries have not been as successful as they might have been is due to lack of economy of scale. You think the Bahamas is doing well now? What do you think would happen if its service industry could benefit from an economic space of approx. 14 million people?!?

And another thing. What the hell do we bahamians care about Jamaica, Guyana or Surinams Bauxite? We don't have a major alluminum manufacturing plant here you nut. :duh: And is Guyana going to give us a CSME members discount on thier gold and diamonds? We should be more concerned about finding out if we have an abundant supply of oil and natural gas in our own country. And how is Jamaica's and Barbadoses tourism infrastructure going to bennefit us here in the Bahamas. Aren'th they our competitors? Its not like they are going to say "We will send some tourist your way Bahamas if your tourism industry was to fall short. And as far as agricultrue goes, our farmers can provide us with the self sufficiancy of producing our own food if our government pays more attention to our local farmers than paying attention to this CSME crap.

The Caribbean does not have to worry about war, famine, disease, poverty and the other ailments that have hindered progress in other resource rich parts of the world such as Africa. Think about the modern day success of places like Singapore that have boomed with so little. Why couldn't/wouldn't we be the same?

There is famine in Haiti. And the caribbean is a haven for diseases and poverty. How can you want us to join this CSME thing if you don't even pay attention to the problems in the region?

It's time to put all this petty regionalism and tribalism behind us. I thought we were more sophisticated than that. Aren't we mature enough to realise that no situation, including the CSME will ever be perfect? Nationalism is a good thing -- don't get me wrong-- but, nationalism at the expense of pushing the nation forward is nothing but detrimental. There is strength in numbers. Together we can be heard and we can resist the tendency to become the puppets of American puppeteers. And, if the Bahamas is as sophisticated as prevailing thought, it will realise this sooner rather than later.

Life is like carnival -- you can either join the procession or stand and look on from the side, just realise that once the procession passes it's hell trying to catch up.

Reading your posts has convinced me that you are somewhat educated but lack knowledge and accuracy.

Reading your posts has convinced me that you are somewhat educated but lack knowledge and accuracy.

100% Bahamian...
I read your comments and I have concluded, even though I completely disagree with your notions, We all must concede that already, (i.e. if you have been reading and watching the news, have already signed on to CSME, even if it is at a limited basis. In Fred Mitchel's last speach, he concluded that the PLP government has signed agreements with Caricom concerning CSME, notwithstanding the fact, the Bahamas has reservations).

I am not sure how you missed Fred Mitchell's speach...

I am not sure how you missed Fred Mitchell's speach...



he kept it quiet!!
:board2: