look!!!!
what some one does that you are unaware of is none of your concern!!!
what the preacher man does with the money of the church is none of our bussiness,and all to do with that pastors soul and his God,and if he is stealing outright then he will be dealt with!!!

if we give tithes it should be what we can afford to give,not because we feel we should give,if a person wants to give all then who are we to stand in the way of it!!!

if a person gives little...who are we to stand in the way of it!!!
and the same people who critisize persons for giving to much,critsize persons who give too little!!!!:shhh:
its just the plain old fickleness in human nature!!!!:rolleyes:
if you are giving with a free heart and knowledge of what you are doing is correct,then you will have no problem in what the pastor.."the man chosen by God to lead the people" does with the tithes....
ITS A SILLY ARGUMENT ESPECIALLY FOR SO CALLED CHRISTIANS!!!:sparky:
you dont ask donald trump what he does with his money after he rips innocent people out of prime real estate!!:dgi:

and another thing......
to all neo-aethiest and christianity haters........
if you believe we are in control of our own destiny,and that the spirrit doesnt guide us,then what happens under the confines of our houses of worship should be of no significance to you!!!

God deals with everyone accordingly....even shady pastors with shady politicians along with shady bussiness people!!!

and another thing...christianity never taught us to follow blindly,it always tells us to read and understand,and seek knowledge!!!
that is why jesus christ came here,to set aside the old ways of spiritual tyranny,and to let us be aware of our own powers of understanding...so the argument of people giving blindly has no validation if you look i the texts of christianity...and understand,what it tells us!!!
holla!!:cop:

look!!!!
what some one does that you are unaware of is none of your concern!!!
what the preacher man does with the money of the church is none of our bussiness,and all to do with that pastors soul and his God,and if he is stealing outright then he will be dealt with!!!

if we give tithes it should be what we can afford to give,not because we feel we should give,if a person wants to give all then who are we to stand in the way of it!!!

if a person gives little...who are we to stand in the way of it!!!
and the same people who critisize persons for giving to much,critsize persons who give too little!!!!:shhh:
its just the plain old fickleness in human nature!!!!:rolleyes:
if you are giving with a free heart and knowledge of what you are doing is correct,then you will have no problem in what the pastor.."the man chosen by God to lead the people" does with the tithes....
ITS A SILLY ARGUMENT ESPECIALLY FOR SO CALLED CHRISTIANS!!!:sparky:
you dont ask donald trump what he does with his money after he rips innocent people out of prime real estate!!:dgi:

and another thing......
to all neo-aethiest and christianity haters........
if you believe we are in control of our own destiny,and that the spirrit doesnt guide us,then what happens under the confines of our houses of worship should be of no significance to you!!!

God deals with everyone accordingly....even shady pastors with shady politicians along with shady bussiness people!!!

and another thing...christianity never taught us to follow blindly,it always tells us to read and understand,and seek knowledge!!!
that is why jesus christ came here,to set aside the old ways of spiritual tyranny,and to let us be aware of our own powers of understanding...so the argument of people giving blindly has no validation if you look i the texts of christianity...and understand,what it tells us!!!
holla!!:cop:
with the above in blue whats the point of having pastors????

look!!!!
what some one does that you are unaware of is none of your concern!!!
what the preacher man does with the money of the church is none of our bussiness,and all to do with that pastors soul and his God,and if he is stealing outright then he will be dealt with!!!

if we give tithes it should be what we can afford to give,not because we feel we should give,if a person wants to give all then who are we to stand in the way of it!!!

if a person gives little...who are we to stand in the way of it!!!
and the same people who critisize persons for giving to much,critsize persons who give too little!!!!:shhh:
its just the plain old fickleness in human nature!!!!:rolleyes:
if you are giving with a free heart and knowledge of what you are doing is correct,then you will have no problem in what the pastor.."the man chosen by God to lead the people" does with the tithes....
ITS A SILLY ARGUMENT ESPECIALLY FOR SO CALLED CHRISTIANS!!!:sparky:
you dont ask donald trump what he does with his money after he rips innocent people out of prime real estate!!:dgi:

and another thing......
to all neo-aethiest and christianity haters........
if you believe we are in control of our own destiny,and that the spirrit doesnt guide us,then what happens under the confines of our houses of worship should be of no significance to you!!!

God deals with everyone accordingly....even shady pastors with shady politicians along with shady bussiness people!!!

and another thing...christianity never taught us to follow blindly,it always tells us to read and understand,and seek knowledge!!!
that is why jesus christ came here,to set aside the old ways of spiritual tyranny,and to let us be aware of our own powers of understanding...so the argument of people giving blindly has no validation if you look i the texts of christianity...and understand,what it tells us!!!
holla!!:cop:

OH Really!!!!! This is just a little bit, to contradicting. Firstly, you agrued that what the Pastor does has NO relevancy to us the FOLLOWERS. You then again turn around and I quote "christianity Never taught us to follow blindly, it always tells us to read and understand and seek knowledge". Now correct me if i am wrong(because it do happen) Doesn't the bible tells us to be accountable for each.

I have a question for you, would you keep giving to a church, where it has been proven that the pastor is corrupt? Would you say it don't matter as long as he (the Pastor) relates to you spiritually. My question to you is, how can he reached you spiritually when he can even reached himself.
That alone says alot of where we are spiritually!

with the above in blue whats the point of having pastors????
the point of having pastors....doctors ....lawyers...accountants,is the same thing!!!
each provide a service or a calling to help their brothers and sisters in time of need!!!!
doesnt mean that they dont make mistakes,or do wrongly!!!
in early greek philosophy there was a paticular group called the "sophites" they were wise ...dont get me wrong,but their methods and their ethical practices left little to be desired,hence entered socrates to challenge ways of operation!!!
such in some lawyers...some pastors ...some doctors!!!!

follow???
holla!!;)

OH Really!!!!! This is just a little bit, to contradicting. Firstly, you agrued that what the Pastor does has NO relevancy to us the FOLLOWERS. You then again turn around and I quote "christianity Never taught us to follow blindly, it always tells us to read and understand and seek knowledge". Now correct me if i am wrong(because it do happen) Doesn't the bible tells us to be accountable for each.

I have a question for you, would you keep giving to a church, where it has been proven that the pastor is corrupt? Would you say it don't matter as long as he (the Pastor) relates to you spiritually. My question to you is, how can he reached you spiritually when he can even reached himself.
That alone says alot of where we are spiritually!
exactly!!!!
we should never follow anything blindly...and if you followed the train of thought and the bold captions which i displayed in the first post you would see the connection!!!
what the pastor does....has no relavancy to us!!!!
what the pastor administers to the congregation has a little to do with us!!!
what we do with the pastors message has entirely to do with us!!!!

take for instance the story of moses!!!!
yes he was chosen by God to lead the people,but he himself didnt see the promise land...doesnt take much away from him,as he was recorded being taken up into heaven..or so we believe!!!
but.......
moses was cruel,stubborn,unrealistic,and arrogant!!!
and still God chose him...and still he led the isrealites!!!!

so with that analogy........ what the pastor has in his heart has nothing to do with us???
when you look at it,it what he even does to us has no relavance,...
but.............
the word he administers is the most important!!!!

for instance,if we decided not to listen to lee iaccoca (president of chrysler..i think!!:confused: )...just because he treated his wife poorly,we may have missed out on the wisdom of one of the most brilliant men ever to grace the bussiness world!!!!

once again....read for understanding........not read to follow the pastor,he is only the guide,and as in the case of moses....can never walk in with you or for you into the promise land!!!!!

holla!!;)

i dont understand our so called christians sometimes....

ok ok ok.....we say that we have to take charge of our own spirituality.....
but in a simple matter of minding you own bussiness we can not grasp!!!!


its amazing!!!!:angel:

i dont understand our so called christians sometimes....

ok ok ok.....we say that we have to take charge of our own spirituality.....
but in a simple matter of minding you own bussiness we can not grasp!!!!


its amazing!!!!:angel:
The original posting was "what the pastor does with tithes is none of our business!!!"

I would ask, "what is the Pastor doing with the tithe in the first place?" The tithe belongs to God, and by extension, the Church. The Pastor, in an ideal case, is an employee of the Church - not God! He benefits from the tithe to pay his wages. However, any remaining tithe goes to the upkeep of the building and the help the poor. The tithe is not the Pastor’s disposable income!

Any Church where the Pastor decides where all the money goes is one to steer clear of. The Pastor is not the Church. The building is not the Church. The fellowship of believers IS the Church. Therefore, the believers (Elected to committees) should be in charge of dispersing the tithe.

The original posting was "what the pastor does with tithes is none of our business!!!"

I would ask, "what is the Pastor doing with the tithe in the first place?" The tithe belongs to God, and by extension, the Church. The Pastor, in an ideal case, is an employee of the Church - not God! He benefits from the tithe to pay his wages. However, any remaining tithe goes to the upkeep of the building and the help the poor. The tithe is not the Pastor’s disposable income!

Any Church where the Pastor decides where all the money goes is one to steer clear of. The Pastor is not the Church. The building is not the Church. The fellowship of believers IS the Church. Therefore, the believers (Elected to committees) should be in charge of dispersing the tithe.
of course.....
why cant you see my reasoning?????
of course...
im not condoning the pastor...or any other for stealing the church money!!!
but..............
they have their own lives to live........
and so do we!!!!!!
so dont follow blindly....which the bible teaches us!!!
dont follow fals prophets...which the bible teaches us!!!!!
examine you own soul....which the bible teaches us!!!
the man of God is the man of God!!!
if he beats his wife last night.....
has no bearings on the message from God he has been spiritualy lead to administer!!!!

doest make him right or wrong!!!!!

it makes him accountable to God........
but to us,he is a vessel of the word on the mornings or times we choose to attend church!!!!!
nothing more........


but another thing.....
if the man of God is blessed with gifts..then why shouldnt he enjoy the fruits of life that were promised to everyone!!!

perry christie enjoys it
donald trum enjoys it
micheal jackson enjoys it.....

so why cant minister..... one the most important beings in our social order????
not inffalible...but important!!!

just as important henry ford was to the automobile!!!!

please you guys!!!

doest make him right or wrong!!!!!

it makes him accountable to God........
but to us,he is a vessel of the word on the mornings or times we choose to attend church!!!!!
nothing more........


but another thing.....
if the man of God is blessed with gifts..then why shouldnt he enjoy the fruits of life that were promised to everyone!!!

perry christie enjoys it
donald trum enjoys it
micheal jackson enjoys it.....

so why cant minister..... one the most important beings in our social order????
not inffalible...but important!!!

just as important henry ford was to the automobile!!!!

please you guys!!!
Of course! There is no reason that a minister cannot enjoy the "fruits of his labour!" Most of them do! However, by the nature of his calling some things are excluded, or shut to him. A good Pastor is careful to avoid even the appearance of living a life not in accord with the "Word" he has chosen to preach.

Perry Christie, Donald Trump, and Michael Jackson are not Pastors. We don’t hold them to the same standards.

Of course! There is no reason that a minister cannot enjoy the "fruits of his labour!" Most of them do! However, by the nature of his calling some things are excluded, or shut to him. A good Pastor is careful to avoid even the appearance of living a life not in accord with the "Word" he has chosen to preach.

Perry Christie, Donald Trump, and Michael Jackson are not Pastors. We don’t hold them to the same standards.
exactly......
and they all enjoy the fruits of their labour!!!!!
never was it stipulated that any one excluded set of individuals shouldnt enjoy the fruits of life...and labour!!!!

and once again you knock ministers......and then set em back on a pedastool....and then knock em off again!!!!!
i dont know how you do it???:dgi:

you put the ministers .lifestyle in accordance to what you think it should be!!!!
Jesus never asked to be put on a pedastool......
and he never asked for anything but to accept him as the son of God!!!!
in fact he said that he was a servant!!!!!
but.........................
and big BUT................................
he never said that anyone else couldnt........
and if a man is wealthy by his works and deeds......
and in fact he never saidthat he didnt want to enjoy it!!!!!
to his personal preferance it meant nothing to him!!!!!
but.........................
all other humans,were free to enjoy the things of life!!!!


yall people gat this ting all backward!!!!:rolleyes:

"exactly......and they all enjoy the fruits of their labour!!!!! never was it stipulated that any one excluded set of individuals shouldnt enjoy the fruits of life...and labour!!!!" Right! But if you are an example to others your life, and your fruits must show it.

"and once again you knock ministers......and then set em back on a pedastool....and then knock em off again!!!!!i dont know how you do it???" Not following you here!

"you put the ministers .lifestyle in accordance to what you think it should be!!!!" No, it says in the Bible what it should be.


"Jesus never asked to be put on a pedastool......and he never asked for anything but to accept him as the son of God!!!! in fact he said that he was a servant!!!!!" The Son of God is not on a pedestal?


"but.......and big BUT.....he never said that anyone else couldnt........" Could not what?


"and if a man is wealthy by his works and deeds......and in fact he never said that he didnt want to enjoy it!!!! to his personal preferance it meant nothing to him!!!!!but.....all other humans, were free to enjoy the things of life!!!!" Of course, within reason.


"yall people gat this ting all backward!!!!" We have it backwards????

you hvent been following what i said since we started...
but i follow you....
i just dont agree!!!!
:realmad:

you say the ministers arent worth a dime...
then you place them up to the laws in which you feel they should be.....
and then knock them when the follow the bible?????
how do you do it??????
the bible says any man can enjoy the fruits of this world...especially when they are servants of the Lord!!!!
but the bible tells us that a man is just a man...pastor or no pastor???
so you expect morality ....fine we all expect morality from our ministers.....
but.................
first dont class all ministers with the fals prophets you chose to surround yourself with!!!
dont class all ministers by the standards you think they should live by!!!!
dont put any man on a pedastool...no matter who!!!!!
if you really understand that a man is just a man...
you can accept the good and the bad out of people!!!!!

you put the pastor before the word!!!!
the cart before the horse!!!!!
you will never get to where you need to go in either of these aspects if you aproach you spirituality like that!!!!

you want something that looks good........
not something that is valuable in any context it is given!!!!
if it was like this universaly...and in the christian church,the poor man and beggar would never be accepted!!!!

dont mind the messenger...mind the message!!!!

you hvent been following what i said since we started...
but i follow you....
i just dont agree!!!!
:realmad:

you say the ministers arent worth a dime...
then you place them up to the laws in which you feel they should be.....
and then knock them when the follow the bible?????
how do you do it??????
the bible says any man can enjoy the fruits of this world...especially when they are servants of the Lord!!!!
but the bible tells us that a man is just a man...pastor or no pastor???
so you expect morality ....fine we all expect morality from our ministers.....
but.................
first dont class all ministers with the fals prophets you chose to surround yourself with!!!
dont class all ministers by the standards you think they should live by!!!!
dont put any man on a pedastool...no matter who!!!!!
if you really understand that a man is just a man...
you can accept the good and the bad out of people!!!!!

you put the pastor before the word!!!!
the cart before the horse!!!!!
you will never get to where you need to go in either of these aspects if you aproach you spirituality like that!!!!

you want something that looks good........
not something that is valuable in any context it is given!!!!
if it was like this universaly...and in the christian church,the poor man and beggar would never be accepted!!!!

dont mind the messenger...mind the message!!!!
I see we are getting no where with this. We shall just have to agree to disagree. Maybe, we are closer to agreement than we think.

Happily, in the fellowship I am in (Buddhist) we have no "Pastor." We collect no money and no one gets paid. There are no pedestals. We all do what we do for the love of it. Maybe that is how it should be?

I see we are getting no where with this. We shall just have to agree to disagree. Maybe, we are closer to agreement than we think.

Happily, in the fellowship I am in (Buddhist) we have no "Pastor." We collect no money and no one gets paid. There are no pedestals. We all do what we do for the love of it. Maybe that is how it should be?

We all do what we do for the love of it.
We all do what we do for the love of it.
We all do what we do for the love of it.
We all do what we do for the love of it.
We all do what we do for the love of it.
We all do what we do for the love of it.

did I say it enough times for you CG you are so right with this last post.

Believe it or not that is how the Rainbow Alliance works as well we have no leader we have a facilitation team but no leader. It’s called an egalitarian system. Members come and go as they need and do what they can. Because after all we have to fear for our lives, livelihoods and our families. But that’s for another thread.