actually I am not an active church member, and it was really my wife's pastor.

but that is the norm at her church, all members use the services for free, too bad other churches don't offer such 'perks' for their customers, er ... members. :D

but what kind of answers you guy's got to help our poverty problem?

I have seen this first hand and i feel that there should be some kind of programs to give them a hand up and to retrained them if possible so that can become working memebers of the bahamas again. I would like to work with someone to bring these issues to the goverment and i willing to do the work to enforce them. The Prime Minister came to my University and spoke to my graduating class.His speech inspired me to do somthing no matter what it takes. I feel there is a need and I am willing to supply my time and effort.

I too would like to help change the poverty in the bahamas.

I was even planning on launching an internet website to
raise funds by getting links placed on thousands of websites.
I would also provide testimonials of people my program reached
including text, photo, audio and even video.

I planned on providing the following:

Homeless shelter/s
Elderly home/s
drop off and pick up service for elderly/disabled
financial assistance with medical bills, grocery, utilities
equipped computerized library with coaching/tutoring
and more ...

but when I thought about the red tape, lawyers, etc

I said to myself is it really worth it?

I mean, I have no problem with being auditted, but
just getting permission to start the company will
most likely be a humongous hurdle.

I have a business liscence and that was a snap,
but i doubt this project would be that easy.

It is my dream to make a difference for the bahamas
in these areas, and just think if I could only raise $1
from 1000 sites per day - $7000 per week.

I don't know why the government tends to overlook
human issues so often - it makes me sick to my stomach
to see my people begging and even working for measly wages.

Just think, if $1 from every tourist that entered the bahamas went to the poor and elderly??

Just think, if $1 from every tourist that entered the bahamas went to the poor and elderly??

Tax the Churchs

While some of the suggestions presented so far seem feasible, they only serve to present short-term relief instead of eliminating the problem at its source.

A PROPER SYSTEM OF EDUCATION is what is needed to eliminate the social ills of this nation. Personally I find it quite interesting that the Honourable Minister, Alfred Sears holds the power to reduce the work burden of one of his two assigned governmental positions by focusing fully upon the other; If he performs his duties as Minister of Education in a manner that proves truly effective, then obviously he will see fewer infractions of Bahamian law in his term as Attorney General.

Educating the masses in a holistic manner is the only true way to improve a society over time. An intelligent society can respect the systems of organization in place due to an implicit UNDERSTANDING of how those systems work. They also will be able to perform their part in the hierarchy of society much more efficiently than if they were left unguided and confused as to how their own personal lives are important to the collective group of people who make up this nation. Instead of pushing our kids through a seemingly ineffective school system which does NOT fully prepare them for embracing their role as a citizen, the Ministry of Education needs to have the tools and the talent to improve the minds of our youth. Within 12 years we could have the beginnings of a completely different society (virtually crime and problem free), but the real question is whether we are up to the task of such a venture.

Some have argued that the “masses” are kept below a certain intellectual level to make them more pliable and easier to manipulate. If any political party within this country has been guilty of this (deliberately or even “unintentionally”) they need to hang their heads in shame. Creating jobs in and bringing money into this country is good, but not if the wealth is not distributed evenly. A competitive society only improves and does not deteriorate in any of its sectors. Creating a society of this type cannot happen in an environment where people are not given the social, physical, intellectual, cultural, emotional and spiritual preparation to improve upon themselves. Leaders who are only interested in “lining” their pockets with money (as well as the pockets of their friends) do not need to be in control of this country, politically, religiously or otherwise. This applies to ALL parties - there is no bias here. The Bahamas as a nation should be where the ultimate loyalty lies for our leaders, not to a political party.

I once said in one of my articles that the leaders of the Caribbean do not seem to be fully interested in building GLOBAL empires as supposed to simply lording over their relevant territories. A country’s size has nothing to do with its potential. Intellect and excellence is respected worldwide. If we give our people a proper program of education which enables them to fight and conquer their own personal challenges, then together we ultimately will have a nation where problems will be relatively nonexistent.

While some of the suggestions presented so far seem feasible, they only serve to present short-term relief instead of eliminating the problem at its source.

A PROPER SYSTEM OF EDUCATION is what is needed to eliminate the social ills of this nation. Personally I find it quite interesting that the Honourable Minister, Alfred Sears holds the power to reduce the work burden of one of his two assigned governmental positions by focusing fully upon the other; If he performs his duties as Minister of Education in a manner that proves truly effective, then obviously he will see fewer infractions of Bahamian law in his term as Attorney General.

Educating the masses in a holistic manner is the only true way to improve a society over time. An intelligent society can respect the systems of organization in place due to an implicit UNDERSTANDING of how those systems work. They also will be able to perform their part in the hierarchy of society much more efficiently than if they were left unguided and confused as to how their own personal lives are important to the collective group of people who make up this nation. Instead of pushing our kids through a seemingly ineffective school system which does NOT fully prepare them for embracing their role as a citizen, the Ministry of Education needs to have the tools and the talent to improve the minds of our youth. Within 12 years we could have the beginnings of a completely different society (virtually crime and problem free), but the real question is whether we are up to the task of such a venture.

Some have argued that the “masses” are kept below a certain intellectual level to make them more pliable and easier to manipulate. If any political party within this country has been guilty of this (deliberately or even “unintentionally”) they need to hang their heads in shame. Creating jobs in and bringing money into this country is good, but not if the wealth is not distributed evenly. A competitive society only improves and does not deteriorate in any of its sectors. Creating a society of this type cannot happen in an environment where people are not given the social, physical, intellectual, cultural, emotional and spiritual preparation to improve upon themselves. Leaders who are only interested in “lining” their pockets with money (as well as the pockets of their friends) do not need to be in control of this country, politically, religiously or otherwise. This applies to ALL parties - there is no bias here. The Bahamas as a nation should be where the ultimate loyalty lies for our leaders, not to a political party.

I once said in one of my articles that the leaders of the Caribbean do not seem to be fully interested in building GLOBAL empires as supposed to simply lording over their relevant territories. A country’s size has nothing to do with its potential. Intellect and excellence is respected worldwide. If we give our people a proper program of education which enables them to fight and conquer their own personal challenges, then together we ultimately will have a nation where problems will be relatively nonexistent.



Of course education is a must for things to change, but unless you are seen as giving and caring, the poor and depressed will not be willing to be educated. The education is here for the taking, it is mostly culture and tradition or the replacement of the same that is leading to our demise.

Instead of picking up a book or doing some reading online, our youth would rather watch tv and learn the latest dance routines - and those with online access don't do much surfing they prefer to chat on msn messenger.

Ha, install messenger 6.2 and let your young niece/nephew use your pc, then check out there saved chat history - then ask yourself if the conversation seems to be be between young kid aged 10-15 or adults in heat. Trust me you will be shocked. But these same kids will be doing pretty bad in school work.

They are caught up with the vanity fed to them ever so subtly on tv, they dress like them, talk like them, act like them, aspire to be them. And many parents don't monitor their kids at all. I beleive children should be free to make their own choices but needs to be pre-programmed in how they should act when they become legal adults. Our children are growing up without a conscience and are living for vanity.

I was shocked to hear that almost 5 of my cousins who get better schooling than myself and my sister, are no even making a 2.0, while my sister and I have always been closer to 4.0 than 3.0 - we had a lot of freedom and were allowed to hang out, etc. But we were trained by our parents to know what society expects of us.

Too many of our adults became adults when they were yet children, and they are producing after their kind. The average child who could use extra help will refuse it because of pride, and in 10 years will be telling the youngsters they meet to get their education! go figure.

Education won't make a difference unless the people receiveing it genuinely believe we care about giving it in the first place. They will think we have an ulterior motive and just reject our help. Free education is already here, they are just rejecting it.

Valid points noted.

Many school children are pulled into the world of adults before they are fully prepared for it, but I do insist that a large portion of the responsibility of preparing them lies on the educational system. (Note that I am not overlooking parental guidance here; I’ll touch on that later)

If blatant rejection of current learning methods seems to be a trend, then it is up to our educators to morph and enhance the tools that they use into more effective ones which do grasp the interest of today’s kids. The ultimate goal for educators is to prepare our youth for the various societal roles that they will perform in the future. Our collective future is under their control every day, literally and figuratively.

It is assumed that the educators of this country make up our intellectual elite. If they cannot figure out how to successfully compete for the minds of our children, then the future of The Bahamas is bound to go spiralling down into the mire of poverty. With suggestions of educational failure as mentioned in the previous post, every teacher, guidance counsellor or school administrator should be dedicating their careers to developing new and more effective ways of teaching and guiding our kids. Preventing poverty lies with teaching responsibility and seeing that some of today’s parents do not seem to grasp that concept, perhaps the educational system can help to reverse this negative trend. Nowadays many kids see their teachers more often than they see their parents anyway. (Families in The Bahamas now have more instances of “latchkey kids” than ever. When I was a kid, the concept of me having a key to my family’s house and being able to come and go as I pleased was NOT an option.)

Overall, I do agree with some of the comments in the previous post, but I do not agree that the current system of education is as effective as it should be – which is one of the main reasons why it is being rejected. A proficient educator would never say, “Oh, they just do not want to learn” – that is very egotistical. The questions that an educator should always be striving to answer are: “What should they be learning?”, “What is the most efficient way for them to learn what I’m teaching?”, “How timely and relevant are my methods for teaching?”, and finally, “Did they actually learn anything?”

Remember that the student does not automatically “learn” to appreciate the process of learning; they are “taught” to appreciate it.

Indeed it can be more effective in educating.

But just as many kids see their teachers more than their parents - which amounts to about 8 hours per day for teachers. They often spend the rest of their day in front of tv or on the internet.

When I was young, I would at least review my work when I got home and often did my homework in class so i could play when i got home after reviewing.

I absorbed most of what was taught because I wanted to, since my parents told me i needed it in the future. Plus, there really weren't that many distractions at home.

I wasn't exposed to sex scenes in every thing on tv, and the net didn't even exist as far as i knew anyway. We had a dresscode for school that kept us looking like children. Skirts were a certain lenght, hair was groomed, etc.

Nowadays, kids do what they want, and teachers are not at liberty to discipline, now the parents come to the school to beat up the teachers. If my parents found out i was disciplined, i would get more of the same from them.

It's really too bad we digressed to this point, and I beleive in the bible, many don't, but this is all expected to happen. I don't think it can be reversed anymore. Our constitution would have to be re-written to not allow all these things from happening.

We can't blame the teachers, we can blame the churches, we can't blame the parents. There are too many bad apples now. When you toss your child into the barrel it will get spoilt like all the other bad apples. the only solution is to remove the bad apples and maybe even change the infected barrel to a new one.

That is remove bad influences/habits and replace them with better ones. self improvement 101. The problem is that everyone will protest when their immoral freedoms are threatened. We like the smut. We like the corruption.
we like everything that is not good for us - it's human nature.

No matter how many people decide to make a change, there will be a dozen bad apples waiting to corrupt them and the weak.

[QUOTE=Vicky]
All we need to do is tax the churchs and build shelters homes and food depots for the poor. No preacher has business having a million $ home.


I dont think thats fair, Preachers are human too, they're just doing God's work :jawdroop: . IF you worked hard for it that's like saying YOU dont deserve to have a million dollar home yourself. I personally dont need it but IF I had the means and I wanted one, that is my individual choice.

But on the topic, not to sound to vague and idealistic but Bahamians are very loving pride-filled people, they dont let their family suffer, Individuals choose the situations theyre in.

As a country collectively, were relatively stable, so that in itself is enough to be grateful of, but we could be doing alot better. It starts with the people, we all have to take the initiative to keep our area's clean.
Whatever happened to "Keep the Bahamas Clean" and Cleanliness is next to Godliness, (Where is the Christian Council and all the other Commissions that the Gov't has set up wasting money when you need them to say something). Or maybe having people that do minor crimes as community service go into areas and clean them up.
Someone owns that land whereever those people live in the bush, round um up and clear the land out.The gov't should enforce the codes on owners who allow people to squat and levy heavy fines if they dont get the situations sqaured away. (and with those heavy fines build a homeless shelter (s) so the people can have somewhere to go)

People need to be held accountable for their own actions, because they can and do have adverse effects on us all, and you can relate this to any area of life!

While some of the suggestions presented so far seem feasible, they only serve to present short-term relief instead of eliminating the problem at its source.

A PROPER SYSTEM OF EDUCATION is what is needed to eliminate the social ills of this nation. Personally I find it quite interesting that the Honourable Minister, Alfred Sears holds the power to reduce the work burden of one of his two assigned governmental positions by focusing fully upon the other; If he performs his duties as Minister of Education in a manner that proves truly effective, then obviously he will see fewer infractions of Bahamian law in his term as Attorney General.

Educating the masses in a holistic manner is the only true way to improve a society over time. An intelligent society can respect the systems of organization in place due to an implicit UNDERSTANDING of how those systems work. They also will be able to perform their part in the hierarchy of society much more efficiently than if they were left unguided and confused as to how their own personal lives are important to the collective group of people who make up this nation. Instead of pushing our kids through a seemingly ineffective school system which does NOT fully prepare them for embracing their role as a citizen, the Ministry of Education needs to have the tools and the talent to improve the minds of our youth. Within 12 years we could have the beginnings of a completely different society (virtually crime and problem free), but the real question is whether we are up to the task of such a venture.

Some have argued that the “masses” are kept below a certain intellectual level to make them more pliable and easier to manipulate. If any political party within this country has been guilty of this (deliberately or even “unintentionally”) they need to hang their heads in shame. Creating jobs in and bringing money into this country is good, but not if the wealth is not distributed evenly. A competitive society only improves and does not deteriorate in any of its sectors. Creating a society of this type cannot happen in an environment where people are not given the social, physical, intellectual, cultural, emotional and spiritual preparation to improve upon themselves. Leaders who are only interested in “lining” their pockets with money (as well as the pockets of their friends) do not need to be in control of this country, politically, religiously or otherwise. This applies to ALL parties - there is no bias here. The Bahamas as a nation should be where the ultimate loyalty lies for our leaders, not to a political party.

I once said in one of my articles that the leaders of the Caribbean do not seem to be fully interested in building GLOBAL empires as supposed to simply lording over their relevant territories. A country’s size has nothing to do with its potential. Intellect and excellence is respected worldwide. If we give our people a proper program of education which enables them to fight and conquer their own personal challenges, then together we ultimately will have a nation where problems will be relatively nonexistent.



THIS IS A MINISTRY OF SOCIAL SERVICE ISSUE, NOT NECCESSARILY EDUCATION.

Tax the Churchs




You suggestion of taxing the church seems to be fuelled by your indifference to Christian churches and Christianity on the whole in the Bahamas. That in my opinion does not seem fair or very feasible to carry out. Churches are private organizations in which persons choose to donate, tithe, or offer their own monies. Its nobody's business including the Governement what happens with that money, even though we are aware that some of the funds from church tithes are not used appropriately. They are private funds donated by private individuals. With that said, it seems more fair and feasible to increase taxes on things like alcohol and tobbacco, and donate those funds to helpingthe less fortunate. WE can probably use the funds garnered to establish education programmes for those who are less fortunate and most times are not sfficiently educated,as a means to make them more efficient in the job market.

As far as pastors living in a 1 million dollar home, if he brought that home with his own funds, then its nobody's business and he should not be criticized, even if those funds came from the church for which he is an employee receiving a salary from the church. If I were a pastor, I would still want a nice home to live in. I am not gong to live like a pauper to make people feel more at ease, or accept my Christianity.

THIS IS A MINISTRY OF SOCIAL SERVICE ISSUE, NOT NECCESSARILY EDUCATION.

Ministry of who?

Social services eh? Properly educating the kids on a holistic level (not just Reading wRiting and aRithmetic) BEFORE they get caught up in behavioural problems REDUCES or ELIMINATES the need for social services to get involved. The educational plan that I'm talking about looks to the future (about 12-15 years).

Typical mentality - Deal with the problem AFTER it has already started.

Typical mentality - Deal with the problem AFTER it has already started.


or better yet...ignore the problem completely and hope it a) goes away or b) someone else fixes it. Both of which are typical ways such problems are dealt with in this country.

You suggestion of taxing the church seems to be fuelled by your indifference to Christian churches and Christianity on the whole in the Bahamas. That in my opinion does not seem fair or very feasible to carry out. Churches are private organizations in which persons choose to donate, tithe, or offer their own monies. Its nobody's business including the Governement what happens with that money, even though we are aware that some of the funds from church tithes are not used appropriately. They are private funds donated by private individuals. With that said, it seems more fair and feasible to increase taxes on things like alcohol and tobbacco, and donate those funds to helpingthe less fortunate. WE can probably use the funds garnered to establish education programmes for those who are less fortunate and most times are not sfficiently educated,as a means to make them more efficient in the job market.

As far as pastors living in a 1 million dollar home, if he brought that home with his own funds, then its nobody's business and he should not be criticized, even if those funds came from the church for which he is an employee receiving a salary from the church. If I were a pastor, I would still want a nice home to live in. I am not gong to live like a pauper to make people feel more at ease, or accept my Christianity.

As I understand it and I could be wrong. Church's are not taxed at all. No property tax, exempt from duties. If the church can afford to build huge buildings they should be taxed. If pastors are getting more than they need then they should be taxed. If their home is modest and on church property then I can see somewhat of a tax break. If the churches have kitchens where they feed the hungry I can see a tax break. If churches have living quarters for the homeless and crises situations then I can see tax breaks. All other should have to pay tax.
Church’s are a business plain and simple.
example how long has the Salvation Army been on Mackey st. ? How long has Neil Elis been preaching. Look at the people everyday out side the Salvation Army Now how many people line up out side other churchs for food. I respect the Salvation Army for what they do and you know they do it. Just look at the people.